Deepak,

Great illustration, never saw it put that way before.

Here is an additional thought in understanding the process. When we are in conlfict and tribulation and struggle, we desire the second even more.

So to much weight given to #1 causes undesirable expereince leading to a shift to #2.

Like you said a natural process.

What helps is the awareness to know there is a process, the wisdom to understand the process, and shift early avoiding the unwanted experience.

Puter crashed, at the library, cut-off from OUR intent; talk about detatchment!

Well, time to sign-off and check out a Chopra book!

O yeah.

Blog you 'guys' as soon as I am able to . . .

peace

So all the chaos and conflict and struggle in the world is simply to lead us to #2 a natural process.

So it has a divine purpose, and it would seem that this could be the first time for all of humanity to crave Peace collectively.

However looking at the world it appears that it has not gotten bad enough yet. Certainly some consciouness shifting going on, even at the highest levels. But some are still clinging and for many the hypnotic spell has not yet been broken so that they can see the apeal of #2 allowing them to let go of #1, so they could actually enjoy #1 while embracing #2.

Thanks Deepak and Richard,

And when you don´t detach at the "right" moment you are remembered by some kind of an experience during the process :)

Learning seems the natural process.

well said...detachment is not a cultivated or enforced virtue; enforcement can have the exact antipodal effects...i perceive it as a "happening" in the natural scheme of things in awareness processes, emerging in understanding and accepting rather than rejecting.

Deepak: many thanks for bringing this up. While desire is something that's fundamental to our everyday existence, detachment is something I've almost never seen discussed in the Western world in the almost two decades I've lived here. Back home in India, even in the westernized culture you find in most major cities today, I think you can find a good-quality swami teaching non-dualism and detachment without too much trouble.

However, I'm not sure if I grasp it completely yet. I guess the process was similar to what most people experience: I first become aware of my desires, then I act on them, and pretty soon I run into society's boundaries. Then when adulthood arrives, with its promise of independence and freedom, one finds that boundaries don't disappear completely, but also that unfettered pursuit of desire doesn't satiate either. So then what you call 'second attention' arrives. I absorbed the karma-yoga philosophy, that we have choice over our actions but not over their results. I read the part of the Gita where Lord Krishna says that He is the "desire that is not opposed to Dharma". Dharma is still a slippery concept to me, but OK, I get that I have desires and I act on them, but there's an I at a deeper level that's untouched by that process. And that's the essence of detachment, I suppose.

But recently I read something by Eckhart Tolle which kinda threw a spanner into the works. He writes that any desire is, in a sense, a non-acceptance of the Now, the present moment. That got me wondering. Is it? Acceptance of the Now doesn't mean I don't want to change anything, does it? I'm still chewing on this. It's impossible to not act; at the very minimum I gotta breathe and eat and poop, etc. And each action (basic or advanced) is preceded by a mental command and therefore a desire. I think maybe Tolle was referring only to those desires that have a strong I-ness about them, where my sense of individuality is attached to the desire. Any thoughts on this, fellow Intentbloggers?

P.S. Deepak, you say "Desire is a give-and-take between what you want to do and what is allowed." Did you mean to say "*struggle* is a give-and-take between desire and what is allowed"?

Is detachment the same thing as amused skepticism?

Seriously, though, lucid dreams can be extraordinarily helpful in determining the nature of ones own detachment because outcomes are not limitless as one might suppose. Expectation is always thwarted. (

You absolutely have to maintain an attitude of awe and, at the same time, non-attachment toward results in order for the lucid dream to continue. The minute you try to affect an outcome, it's over.

Let's just say you decide to stick your head through a mirror. Can you set up an expectation of what you will see? Outcomes would be limitless if you could (limitless outcomes would have to mean that even your conscious expectations could come to fruition). But they don't.

The minute you try to realize ANY expectation, it's over...you either go back to sleep or you wake up.) You cannot interfere with outcomes (effect). You can only experiment with the causal component.

That is especially true in terms of your more primative desires which will IMMEDIATELY terminate the dream.

Personally, the most rewarding thing I've learned to do in a lucid dream is to begin to focus intently on detail. Oh, there's a newspaper. I wonder what it says. I wonder what it will do if I look away and then return to the print. Stay where I am without moving from place to place. Study my hands intently.

Happy dreaming.

You kmow sWORDSman today was the first time I realized the intention behind your name. Now why is that?

Well the last few days I have been trying to figure out what actually causes me to do something. Of all the things I could do at any moment what decides what I do.

The other day I was watching carefully when would I actually get up and do something. Write now I am in a period where there are not to many worldy forces dictating what I should do or when. I have a list a mile long of things I think know I need to do like generate revenue. I have some things way overdue, but I just can't do them.

There are small things like today my daughter saying we need a ride to the mall to catch a bus. So I go through those motions without a thought. I don't have any negative thoughts or like what a bother I just do it.

So I waited the other day and all of sudden I just got up and acted. It happened, I did not really give a command I got a compulsion.

Now it is driving me nuts because I keep thinking I need to be doing something else. Not reading this site or posting comments here. But I am getting this compulsion and it is really frustrating. I tell myself I need to practice some self discpline.

To sum it up I am not sure where my will comes from. Like those things I need to do, all of a sudden a compulsion comes and I will actually do them.

Everything seems to happen with perfect timing.

But I don't know that I am actually doing it. In fact what gave me the compulsion to write these words? It was like I couldn't resist it.

Maybe I am just watching something else.

But that all plays back to I am just an event unfolding.

and my next thought will be...

what do I need to do next?

The thought "hit the post button"

then the awareness I had not filled the URL field

so I do that.

now i hit the post button

In the beginning...

Did the point in space that contained Everything...

that was perfect, whole and complete within itself...

did it have a desire to expand and let go of it's attachment to itself?

Did God have a "Ahh-ha!" moment producing "clear vision"?

Did He finally see the Light, or imagine it first?

Why did He do it? You know...BANG, really BIG?

What was His justification?

Was He making an attempt to accomplish something?

Did He not enjoy/like/prefer the Way things were?

Or did He have a desire to change?

If it was an accident, like...He didn't mean to,

and He's supposed to be the "Cause without a cause",

then who or what caused the mistake? The Law?

If God were concious of Himself, Omnipotent... as in

"nothing is impossible"...

could He make Himself go away?

From where to where would He go?

.

If we are ALL, SELF, One Mind and what-not...

we should All have the same desires.

Oh..."hidden deep within" we actually do, you say.

Desires to Be and act like the God in the Highest?

But...there is no high, low, back or forth in space.

.

I detach myself from questions such as these

and wallow in the muck and darkness

like a spore, waiting for some creature to

shit on the Earth so I can become That which

I was always meant to Be,

a mushroom! Glory be to God!!!

Keith,

That event never happened, the universe, does not work like that. There isn't a beginning.

If you eat a magic mushroom you can become One.

Dear Deepak,
This post touches a sensitive point. I have been asking myself for years, when will I be like Paramahansa Yogananda? After all, he wished for God, and only God, since his early childhood. How can one's consciousness be like his since birth? And finally, how many lifetimes does it take for all desires to become completely one-pointed like his? Of course, I am aware that my desire to be like Yoganandji is the opposite of vairagya, or detachment. I am aware that I am even supposed to practice meditation without too much desire for enlightenment. What could be more contradictory than that?

As you pointed out, the more expanded the consciousness is, the more our desires spring from our soul. The body is limited in its needs and wants, and is searching for fulfillment in the world. The soul, instead, is only seeking God, and only wants to contemplate God.
Thank you for another beautiful post.
Love,
Donatella

Donatella,

Why would God want to contemplate God?

Rather God would want to contemplate Donatella.

Love Always in All ways

Your Self

Oh, yeah. Daddy brings it home with beats.

Richard,
You have a point.
Thanks,
Donatella

Detached You are, even from your being

Detached You are, even from your being,
and this being is nothing but You.
Unmanifest, yet the manifest is naught
but Your shadow.

Moons, galaxies and worlds drunk from this cup.
And the cupbearer is nowhere to be seen!

By Abu-Said Abil-Kheir (Sufi poet)

Donatella and Richard, you both made excellent points and counterpoints.

Donatella, you especially have a point in acknowledging a point. I hope you agree that I have a point. Even if you don't agree, if you are fair you would acknowledge my point.

Thanks,

SM

Dear Dude,
I am willing to acknowledge you and your point.
Thank you.
Donatella

SM and Donatella,

I am sure it's all the same point.

Richard, I thought you said that space was expanding

away...

way..

ay...

y

hi! Deepak . Detachment is the key.. in many ways .. sort of an stick to start your journey with. Many masters have / had perfect this art ( it is an art in many ways)

This is probably what Siddarth and Mahavir used to become what the are.

thanks .. .. for waking this feeling for detachment. ( as like many other noble thougts ) this one too hibernates without focus.

I love detachment. When I can manage to detach life becomes an adventure, full of surprises.

Whenever the subject of detachment comes up, I always tell my friends, "Is duniya mein agar kuch pakadne laayak nahin hai, to kuch chhodne laayak bhi nahi hai".
(If there's nothing worth latching on to in this world, there's nothing worth running away from either.) That's what Rajneesh Osho used to say too.

Cheers!
Navin

Keith,

Yes, it appears to be expanding, in fact the expansion is accelerating and they can't explain why. But Keith I must ell you, you are a genius. You know why?, You said space is expanding. That is the correct answer. The other perspective is that you are shrinking, that's what infinitesimal points do.

Deepak: Was thinking about you this afternoon, and the notions of your second post about the Higher-Self; "What you focus on is what expands" came to mind, again, in not so much resisting the concerns and foci of the lower-self; but rather simply tuning in on the other set.

If the saying, "What you resist, persists," or as Jesus said, "Do not resist evil (the tenets of the ego's paradigms) are true, then a truer understanding of the confounding paradox of desire also reveals it's "true intent" more easily.

I realize that many bloggers don't like long posts, so "scroll on," as it were (in other words "White Wings"--no need for a poetic dedication here).

.....but, for those few who do find merit in anything I bring to the Intentblog, I was thinking about us all today as I reread these words from "The Life and Teaching of The Masters of The Far East"--I earmarked this page with "that feeling" that I would soon be posting it here; these words very much echo the precision of Deepak's latest series of posts:

(pg. 136 of Vol. 1 of the newer six-part composite, as DeVross publishing found some additional files in their warehouse in the early 90's that brought about vol. six)--I've also broken up on long paragraph into:

"Jesus said, 'Blessed be the poor in spirit,' realizing that any limitation in life that can create a desire in the individual to rise superior to the limitation and free himself from it is good.

He realized that need is the prophecy of fulfillment. He looked upon every need as soil prepared for a seed. If the seed were planted, then allowed to grow and come forth, ii would fill the need.

Need or desire, in the unfoldment of life, is misunderstood. That it must be crushed out of the heart is taught by some great teachers. Jesus said, 'Woe unto you who are satisfied.'

If you are satisfied, you are at a standstill. In order to contact life fully, we must seek each moment to express life fully. Desire for this is the urge toward it.

Weary of crawling in the dust of the earth, man yearns to fly, and this longing invites him tofind the manifestation of law that will enable him to rise above his present limitations.

Finding it, he is able to go where he will, without thought of time or distance. It has been said that man proposes and God disposes.

The reverse is true, for God proposes and man disposes; if man is so disposed, he can do all that God does. Cannot the Son do what the Father has done?"

The failure of outer things to satisfy leads the soul to seek the power within. Then the individual may discover that I AM, he may know that within him lies all power to satisfy the soul to fulfill its every need and desire.

This knowledge may not come until the individual is driven by the buffetings of the world to seek this inner plane of peace and calm.

When he knows I AM is the fulfillment of his desire, the desire is filled. To look outside the God-Self for the fulfillment of his desire is folly. To unfold, the Self must do the unfolding."

This six-part series was generated from the exact details recorded by a group of "11 skeptical scientists and engineers" as they journeyed and lived with some of the most developed souls that have ever walked the face of this earth, and for 3 1/2 continous years of research and travel throughout Persia, the Himalayas (India/Tibet, tc.), China and Mongolia--with "The Masters of the Far East, from 1894-1898 (for which records also indicate the presence of both Jesus, and his cousin "John-John," John the Baptist, during their "recorded" lifetimes.

How very similar to what Deepak continues to devote himself to both learning, then actualizing for himself, while simultaneously more deeply learning this direction by teaching these tenets, and in light of, and in spite of, all those who attempt to degrade his messages and say he is "just doing it for the money."

Jesus turned down Kingdoms that were offered to him would he but teach "the Kings" how to do what he could do; maybe because he could materialize money, and any other needs for those around him, and far beyond anything he needed for himself--is that not a demonstration of unlimited wealth--a Universal "Platinum Card" with no principle or interest due--except to continue to receive, so as to have more to give?

Certainly to both Geeta and Keith, who I know are reading these works, I was indeed thinking of you both as well, as I also continue to impregnate the paradigms-of-thought presented by these works, and into my own mind, ever-deeper and more active through repetition (over...and over....and over... until...???!!!!)--Much Love to the reader-s, esp. for patience if you made it this far! Dave

David,

Now that this thread is a few days old,

I suppose it's okay to talk to you here.

Volume 4, six weeks later, done...whew.

I'm with Geeta on needing my own set of 1-6.

Find them, buy them and send them to us, will ya?

.

My new economic situation is looking like North's and Craig's.

Money from nothing...or is it"Money for Nothing"

as those in "Dire Straits" live and speak of, I need more.

There are a few folks here who seem to be able to do

what they wish because time and money are no problem for them.

I Am not one of them, or you, for that 'matter'.

Silver Spoon, born and bred, I Am not...not that you are.

Do I take a chance on Faith and pray, only once,

that I will seek and find just enough to get by?

Now feeding and caring for 4, how risky can I be?

My savings will be depleted completely if things

and events don't go as well as they could, without 'magic'.

.

I'm not greedy, although this neighborhood has

more than enough richness and extra rooms to make

one like Me2 a bit envious. It's beautiful around here

and the folks care for their yards like a Country Club.

I walk at night, after too much supper, to gawk

and gaze and wonder if they're all lawyers,

doctors, bankers or what.

To bring you 'on-line', I purposely screw up

the readings so you'll come-over and talk.

I use the general concensus of science.

What a gap we still have. Where are the bridges

burning and should we 'put them out'?

Anyway, I'll go get vol. 5 Monday and continue.

I'll stop now, you may not join in here at all.

I figure you don't want to e-mail and that we shall

do our laundry in public...so be it.

I'll be waiting, what will be will be, que sara sara. Keith~

Keith: It is my opinion that we don't always get what we think we want (and thank God that we don't--since what we think we want is always changing)--but....we do always get what we need, especially the assistance we need when we are no longer "needed here"--to go elsewhere, wherever else we are needed after "here-and-now."

If you do not believe me, then consider how many times you were certain you were at the end of your rope, and yet, you are walking the streets of a very nice neighborhood at night, you had supper, the kids are OK--Spirit knows what you need for your journey, even before you do--it's just unpleasant at times, since this is a school of extreme dualities and contrasts--so ask why sooooo....many souls will incarnate into the most horrendous of circumstances, at times only to touch into the physical for minutes, days, weeks, and then starve or die of starvation-related illnesses--by the billions.

Does that mean those lives are wasted as a soul experience--might some of them be coming in and going through this grueling agony as a means of developing soul-level compassion for others, and cause the rest of us to take notice, on a massive scale, of how out-of-balance we are regarding what we think need (most could be classified as "wants!"), vs. what we really need for our greater individual/collective "soul growth?"

Is it possible that the "....Masters" series already provided for you, nearly free of charge (gas/time, late fees?!), at your local library, was already anticipated by your Spirit-Self, and that you are actually doing quite well, in that you even have a savings account to say "is diminishing?"

We'll do the e-mail thing one of these days; I'm completely delinquent in trying to keep up with anybody but Patzi--and delinquent even then regarding all that I would say to her were she sitting on my balcony with me (in other words, Keith, I'm a lazy SOB)--but....no worries about laundry, mate--we can always bounce over to Open Thread, or we'll just spread the laundry out so it's not too piggy and dominant in any one blog-topic.

Keith--it's not exactly like the Intentblog audience isn't used to my/our random babbling, n'est pas?! Dave

Detachment is being aware of something without desiring or resisting it.

The value of it is that it allows you experience things without any added distortion from your own judgments.

This allows you to more completely understand what you have put your attention on.

If it is an internal object such as an incomplete emotional issue or memory, it allows you to hold the issue in the meditative space.

The pure awareness of the meditative viewpoint will allow the emotional content to resolve or complete, thus liberating the mental energy you had tied up in the incompletion.

Many of the most successful emotional technologies are technologies which bring the person, after some technique, to the point where they can hoild their emotion non-judgmentally and be with the emotion, fully feeling it, but not desiring or resisting it.

As the issue completes, the mental energy needed to keep it incomplete is freed up and regained by the person.

The issue falls away like a dead leaf (or becomes a "roasted seed" to use another popular metaphor for this process), and the person feels clear, refreshed and energized.

The "roasted seed of karma" metaphor arises because putting a thought into the attention beam of pure, meditative awareness purifies the thought in a way which is similar to a burning process, much like the way an ozone product or hydrogen peroxide burns away germs or dirt.

A person such as Patanjali or the Buddha has gone though a very deep process of exposing all the contents of their mind to the meditative awareness, even such near and dear concepts as God and Self. Along the way are many issues that we have buried in the subconscious mind that will be cleared, just like clearing out corners in the basement or the attic when we remodel a house.

If you can hold sexual energy in the space of meditative awareness, without acting on it or supressing it, you will experience tantra.

Tantra is not about fulfilling sex fantasies. This is a completely wrong understanding of tantra that, unfortunately, too many hedonists and opportunists have capitalized on.

Tantra is about exposing the energy of sex to pure (detached) meditative awareness for the purpose of transforming the energy of sex. The energy of sex is so powerful, that if even a portion of it is transformed, it can send you into deep meditative spaces.

The point of tantra is not sex. The point of tantra is meditation. I say this to help anyone who is interested in tantra, because the world is full of charlatans that want to abuse you and disguise it with spiritual talk.

If you can hold the concept of Self in the meditative space, you will undergo a process of slowly dis-identifying with all the definitions of self until you reach meditative emptiness.

If you hold the concept of God in the space of detached meditative awareness, all your beliefs about God will eventually be exposed for your observation, then fall away. Whenever you start panicking that you cannot exist without your belief, you will attach again to your thought process, and disrupt the meditative process.

If you can go all the way with these kinds of exercises, you will experience some profound understandings and release many thought distortions that have cluttered your consciousness throughout this life.

The antidote to the fear that you cannot exist without your beliefs in Self or God is this: understand that whatever is eternal and real, you will not be able to dissolve with meditative awareness, because whatever is eternel and real is not a karma that can be burned away. Therefore you need not fear burning away the real God or your Essential Self. You may burn away some deep fears, however. Just hang in there and stay focused and relax, letting it all rise and fall without grasping it or pushing it away.

This is the essence of meditation, whatever technique you use, even if it is a very active technique such as ecstatic dancing, whirling, or even carthatic technologies such as Osho's Dynamic Meditation or the Mystic Rose (alternate cycles of laughing, crying, and silence), the technique should finally bring you to a place of meditative silence where detached awareness can burn away your karmas.

The simplest technique, and yet also one of the hardest to achieve, is pure sitting. It could be called a no-meditation meditation, because you are not even trying to meditate. No mantra, no breathwatching, no technique at all. You are just allowing everything to rise and fall without desiring or resisting. Just naturally being present. Meditation will arise all by itrself.

For those who find that approach too dry, there's always the luscious music and dancing meditations. And there's Primal Scream and Dynamic and Laughing and Crying for people who believe they have to open the Pandora's box of the unconscious, Freudian style, and let it all blast out.

It doesn't matter as long as the technique leads you eventually to meditative silence.

It's fun and enlightening to taste all the different varieties of the meditative techniques from different traditions.

Hello Deepak and Everyone,

just a little compliment to Deepak's post.

To give something up is not true detachment. To know and understand that the world is untrue is genuine detachment. Nisargadatta

peace ruth

Giving up the knowledge that the Earth is truly

my "home sweet home" for the belief that the world

is untrue is not detachment?

This body and this brain of mine were born from

the nutrients of this Earth and the atmosphere above us.

Let us not forget, we are not built to live under

any other conditions, such as The Moon or Mars.

Let us not forget the absolutely perfected Nature

of our organic biological systems, suited to

intelligence and movement, lest we get stuck in the mud.

Just because we don't understand our very own nature,

we have no right to knock it.

Turn off your sympathetic nervous system tonight

and tell us in the morning how much control your

mind has over these very materialistic matters.

What do we control...really?

If the earth is untrue and All is Illusion,

why all the fireworks over how to fix It?

Yogi-One: Very much appreciate what you've detailed in #2--ThanK You!

Keith: I wonder that it is not the physical world itself that is "untrue, or unreal;" but rather, the way we've grown to perceive it that is so askew?

When the Buddha says this world is "maya--or illusion," does he refer to the world, or to our perceptions of it--and each other? Dave

deepak,

i am always amazed at how you take the most fundamental concepts that probably everyone on this site already knows in their heart and has thought about, but write about it a way that is refreshing and appeals to people's most basic desire- to understand themselves and understand the world around them.

anyway, it was a nice refresher on the importance of developing detachment. thank-you.