In one of Deepak Chopra's books, he tells a story about a young boy who had actually changed some of his own DNA (I believe the boy accomplished this in response to his mother's urging that he get well.)

Which book was that? I'm desperately trying to find out! Thank you!

Dear Deepak,

Thank you for writing this book. I read this book and filled with gratitude for revealing many secrets of life and death. I was thrilled to read the topics that you have addressed.

Love,
Venky

Life After Death

Scientists say that entire universe was
born out of a singularity. It progressed
from hydrogen to helium to oxygen and
water and then eventually bacteria,
viruses and humans too were born!

Scientists further state that universe
will eventually go back to a singularity Again!
Or else expand forever into darkness and death
… a philosopher’s nightmare.

I wonder what that tells about all the
rebirth 'stories' and, about the 'life
after death'!

But, then, I think all these 'stories'
have this concept of 'waiting' one can
be 'waiting' for eons to take birth -
and, I wonder how 'painful' such
'waiting' might be - and, then just
when you though you had a womb, a
potential mother and a potential 'life'
- your mother decides to 'abort'! That
could be Quite Painful indeed!

But, luckily, I think all these
'stories' are mostly just
'speculations' and, in reality, no one
really has any real clue about it!

I think ultimately science is the only
one that can answer the question of
"life", "death", 'life after death' and
'rebirth' and so far, even science has
no real answer for any of these!

Adithya

I Am Eternal Unlimited Awareness.

When someone says I [the 'thinking'
'mind'] am really Only Awareness; I
have no real problem! This is something
that I [the thinking mind] can easily
test and verify and find proof within!
When someone says that the root of me
[the thinking mind] is Awareness - I
have no real problem - I can really see
it to be the case within myself!

I am unlimited awareness - there too I
see no problem - I reality, in order to
see a 'limit' I [thinking mind] have to
think without thinking I can not become
aware of any 'limit' [or anything
'else' for that matter]! The root
awareness can have no intrinsic sense
of 'limit'!

I am eternal unlimited awareness -
that too I can easily test and verify -
Awareness is my [thinking mind's]
root and it always precedes and
outlasts me [the thinking mind]!
It is not possible for me [the thinking
mind] to see the origin and end of something
[Awareness] that outlasts me in every
possible dimension! Therefore, as far
as I [the thinking mind] can EVER know –
I [Awareness] am truly Unlimited,
eternal Awareness!

Your ['you' meaning Pure Awareness in
this case] real nature is bliss - TRUE,
root all my problem is in 'thinking' -
no thinking no 'concept' of 'problems' -
no concept of problems = non-existence
[in my mind] of problems!

[Your] World is a product of you
[awareness] - true - my [mental] world
only exists when I think - when I don't
think the [mental] world ceases!

When you Abide as Self [Pure
Awareness] there is Peace - true - all
[mental] disturbances are the product
of thinking!

I find all these theories Simple,
Direct, TRUE, Authentic, Rea, Powerful
and easily Verifiable!

The trouble comes when someone tries
to "project" more than that! To me,
such theories include:

- All is One!

- Soul

- Rebirth

- Nirvana [as in 'freedom' from
'rebirth']

- Enlightenment [as in NEVER having
'ignorance' Again]!

Adithya Comming

Human beings should be allowed to fall back

on the only intelligence and knowledge that we have...

our own!

Please have faith in that, at least.

Scientist are humans, just like us.

They want to know how everything works...so would I.

We really haven't been on this planet that long.

Shouldn't we give ourselves a million years

to figure this whole thing out, slowly but surely?

In the mean ol' time...why not take on the very best

attitude, or Philosophy of Life/Death, that we can?

I figure...most of us won't be around in our current-bodies.

Our bodies-electric will lose these shells,

shed them for some novel mutated ones,

and then we might get a few more answers,

which always and always invites more questions!

I have faith and hope in our species,

if only because I love the way we work!

Don't you?

Even "chop wood, carry water" has it's benie-fits.

Don't forget to whistle thru that smile of yours!

Ref, Post#3

The best science can say about the universe's formation, according to a theory gaining strength, is that all manifestation is a function of a
probability wave, Psi. - a thing of mathematical language. But which can explain a cosmological fuzz that in our observable universe evolved
classically. God doesn't play dice with the universe, said Einstein to Schrödinger & Bohr. Poor guy, he was so close. And there are
countless other dimensions and universes.

A branch of the M-Theory mathematically attempts to prove that there is an endless progression of
symmetry breaking, in a perfect reflection of the Vedic notion of Vishnu dreaming forth an infinite series of Brahmas, each one a countless
creator of a particular universe. And here we are, an awareness within some facet of it all, wondering, "What's it all about?" Just love, for
there's Brahma...

ARJ(BL)

"And here we are, an awareness within some facet of it all..." ARJ(BL)

Perhaps rather than being an awareness within some
facet of it all, we are that Awareness in which it
all takes place.

Durga

Dear Deepak,

Thank you for reminding me that "I am".

Love,
Donatella

"Perhaps rather than being an awareness within some
facet of it all, we are that Awareness in which it
all takes place."

Touche, Durga.

All my love,

Ashoka

ARJ wrote: “The best science can say about the universe's formation, according to a theory gaining strength, is that all manifestation is a function of aprobability wave, Psi. - a thing of mathematical language. But which can explain a cosmological fuzz that in our observable universe evolved classically. God doesn't play dice with the universe, said Einstein to Schrödinger & Bohr. Poor guy, he was so close. And there are countless other dimensions and universes.A branch of the M-Theory mathematically attempts to prove that there is an endless progression of symmetry breaking, in a perfect reflection of the Vedic notion of Vishnu dreaming forth an infinite series of Brahmas, each one a countless creator of a particular universe. And here we are, an awareness within some facet of it all, wondering, "What's it all about?" Just love, forthere's Brahma..."

Durga wrote: Perhaps rather than being an awareness within some facet of it all, we are that Awareness in which it all takes place.

God made everything out of nothing,
and the nothingness shows through.

- I forget the attribution

I am often amused by the repeated attempts of scientists to develop ever more creative ways of defining'nothingness' as something that exists in and of itself.

as I see it, the attempts during our lifetime have come closer and closer to proving that 'nothing actually exists' - as evidenced by the infinitesimally smaller 'substances' that are posited as comprising matter and the increasingly more probability-based theories of a substrate.

these theories seem to all have the underlying assumption that indeed there must be something substantial as the basis of matter.

I am also amused by the fact that scientists are believed only due to convincing a few fellow 'believers' (i.e., with like minds) that what they say must indeed be true.

interestingly, scientists cannot PROVE their most fundamental assumption, that something does exist in and of itself, i.e., independent of the mind of the observer.

dare I suggest that without this assumption, science be considered no more valid, than say, religion?

yet, they are quick to dismiss the words of hundreds of sages as being unverifiable. :-)

LOL!
hilarious...isn't it?

clay

"God made everything out of nothing,
and the nothingness shows through." quoted by Clay

'Who' or 'what' you think is THAT 'God' who 'made 'everything' out of 'nothing'?

And, then we can also try to see what is meant by 'nothing' and what sperates it from a 'thing'?

Adithya

"God made everything out of nothing,
and the nothingness shows through."

just opinions…

"'Who' or 'what' you think is THAT 'God' who 'made 'everything' out of 'nothing'?"

God was not the operative word here. feel free to substitute any other word of your choosing which will convey the meaning of 'that which is responsible for our existence', whether it's a principle, a force, an energy, an omniscient being.

“And, then we can also try to see what is meant by 'nothing' and what sperates it from a 'thing'?”

the only thing that has every separated 'everything' from 'nothing' is a thought in a mind.

:-)
clay

"Thank you for writing this book. I read this book and filled with gratitude for revealing many secrets of life and death."

Gosh, Chopra died and lived to tell about it.

Next book will be on his Resurrection.

Stay tuned.

Post #11 by Clay:

“And here we are, an awareness within some facet of it all, wondering, "What's it all about?" Just love, forthere's Brahma..." ARJ

“ Perhaps rather than being an awareness within some facet of it all, we are that Awareness in which it all takes place.” Durga

"God made everything out of nothing,
and the nothingness shows through.

- I forget the attribution”

-Does it matter?

"I am often amused by the repeated attempts of scientists to develop ever more creative ways of defining'nothingness' as something that exists in and of itself."

-How about using a dictionary for the word "nothingness"?

"as I see it, the attempts during our lifetime have come closer and closer to proving that 'nothing actually exists' - as evidenced by the infinitesimally smaller 'substances' that are posited as comprising matter and the increasingly more probability-based theories of a substrate."

-Does the apple one is eating taste any better when it is not really existing in theory? :-D

"these theories seem to all have the underlying assumption that indeed there must be something substantial as the basis of matter."

-Scientists have their "big bang", theists have their "creator". Not to mention the "searching theorists of everything" so the cosmos can be explained 100%, verifiably.
Any bet that mankind won't find it, ever?

"I am also amused by the fact that scientists are believed only due to convincing a few fellow 'believers' (i.e., with like minds) that what they say must indeed be true."

-Anyone not schooled in observation, subsequent efforts to explain, resulting in the formulation of a theory (a conclusion based on repeatable observation, from which other (not yet available) observations can be predicted) has some homework left. The above phrase nicely fits Einstein's work on relativity.

"interestingly, scientists cannot PROVE their most fundamental assumption, that something does exist in and of itself, i.e., independent of the mind of the observer."

-Brush up on physics: matter might look stable in terms of human lifespan but sooner or later just vanishes: it's unstable.

"dare I suggest that without this assumption, science be considered no more valid, than say, religion?"

-Bad science sooner or later gets corrected (phlogiston theory debunked) despite clerical obstruction (Galileo) whereas, because religion isn't science, in religion, confusion only grows. Just take a look at kundalini related texts in the various systems and have a good laugh. yet, they are quick to dismiss the words of hundreds of sages as being unverifiable. :-)

"LOL!
hilarious...isn't it?
Clay"

-Yea, almost as hilarious as the non-existing climate change 8-)

Jan

Dear Deepak, I truly enjoyed all these 9 posts!! Reading these stories for you as a child; evidently, imbedded a deep sense of clarity in you. Thanks for clearing many muddy pools of doubt.

Tonights read, deeply resonated within me...I found myself saying, "I AM"

with loving kindness,
North

I think some may have misunderstood the apostrophe on this phrase I wrote: "Just love, for there's Brahma..."

Perhaps I should have written: "Just love, because within love is Brahma... Vishnu... Shiva... the 1008X names of the Mother... the whole thing... "GOD" YOU

ARJ

ARJ

That reminds of the Holy X, beyond the unconditional love transcending the senses and the mind, inexpressible, present in particles and all compound structures thereof (including donuts and roundabouts), immaterial and yet...
estimable to a high degree and mattering!

 What is X ?

ecira

Ecirada in post #15 wrote:

“Does it matter?”

no, of course, not.

” How about using a dictionary for the word
"nothingness"?”

better yet, I can explain the great leap I made.

I was using the word 'nothingness' (as per the quote about God making everything out of nothing) as a substitute for 'matter', or whatever scientists currently believe our universe is comprised of.

”Does the apple one is eating taste any better when it is not really existing in theory? :-D”

definitely not, the apple seems to taste better when there are no other thoughts, theoretical or otherwise.

” Scientists have their "big bang", theists have their "creator". Not to mention the "searching theorists of everything" so the cosmos can be explained 100%, verifiably.
Any bet that mankind won't find it, ever?”

I'll take that bet, that it won't be found ever (to the satisfaction of all).

” Anyone not schooled in observation, subsequent efforts to explain, resulting in the formulation of a theory (a conclusion based on repeatable observation, from which other (not yet available) observations can be predicted) has some homework left. The above phrase nicely fits Einstein's work on relativity.”

do 'we' (all) still believe Einstein's theory of relativity? I can't (be bothered to) keep track.

”Brush up on physics: matter might look stable in terms of human lifespan but sooner or later just vanishes: it's unstable.”

why am I not surprised?

” Bad science sooner or later gets corrected (phlogiston theory debunked) despite clerical obstruction (Galileo) whereas, because religion isn't science, in religion, confusion only grows. Just take a look at kundalini related texts in the various systems and have a good laugh.”

LOL!!!
indeed, you are quite right, the scientists do seem to at least agree on the meanings of words, i.e., they share a common vocabulary

Clay

What can possibly get 'reborn'?

All that I can see as possibly get
'reborn' or 'resurrected' is only a sense
of IDENTITY!

What I see in the root of 'myself' is
only a sense of IDENTITY!

What an 'enlightenment' and 'nirvana'
can supposedly make me "free" of is...
this sense of IDENTITY!

What is the feeling of being one with
the Universe is... simply 'suspension'
of this 'sense of identity'!

But, this 'identity' as I have
experienced, known and understood it...
is Purely a Biological Entity! It is
purely a product of [physical] Brain
and... it gets "born" only when that
part of the brain becomes Active!

If somehow you put that part of the
brain to "sleep" - 'identity' will
disappear too! And, it already happens
in Deep Sleep, Meditation and Samadhi!

Yet, when we are back from deep sleep
or Samadhi - identity is functional
again just because that functionality,
that potential of brain is still
Intact! If somehow, that functionality
itself was [physically] damaged 'I' [as
the 'person'] will die in this Life
itself and will NEVER get 'reborn'
unless that functionality was
'restored' again!

This already happens to some extent in
people lose their memory due to some
accident! In a way, though they still
have a functionally identity [a sense
of 'me'] - they are 'no longer' the
same 'person'!

Because of the removal of memory, they
have already lost bunch of 'personal'
problems [and resulting pain] just in
this Life! The 'personal' problems they
have lost include 'what somebody did to
them, their family, parents, children'
[something that "spiritual" 'seekers'
often spend lot of money, time and
energy in trying to overcome]! However,
in such cases, we as society are there
to help them "recreate" these
'problems' [memories] and resulting
pain Again :)

Such a person, because of little
damage to the [physical] brain has lost
part of his 'person' just by having
lost part of the 'personal memory'!
There has also been report of people's
change of 'emotions', 'feelings' and
'behavior' because of another kind of
damage to the physical brain! Combining
these two, we see that [the part] of me
[who we think we are] CAN NOT even
'survives' the physical damage of the
brain! Then, based on that, what are
its chances of surviving TOTAL Death of
the Brain?
Even thinking that 'there must be
something more to it' too is part of
the SAME brain! The brain being
primarily a SURVIVAL tool is
evolutionary trained to do everything
that will increase its chances of
SURVIVAL and a strong belief in a
'concrete', 'real' identity certainly
buys it that! Belief that the "me" [its
sense of 'identity'] is something
distinct, real, and independent and not
just a 'product' of some chemical
reactions definitely helps it in
*controlling* resources in the
protection of that identity [which is
considered more than a "hallucination"
now]!

Based on the same 'theory', it is my
"guess" that no 'living' human
[including likes of Ramana, Amma,
Tolle] is free of this IDENTITY! This
identity is PURELY a 'biological'
function; though, it can be 'asleep'
for varying length of time but, it can
not be 'dead' in any normal biological
body! It is a biological function -
and, a very Essential Biological
Function!

The 'sense of identity' that we know
and feel is simply a product of this
biological 'function' [chemical
reaction]! Interestingly, this 'sense
of identity' is only a feeling of "me".
It has no sense of a 'person' - it has
no intrinsic 'ego'! This 'feeling'
becomes a 'sense of 'person''; a
'mental' 'image' of me* only after it
gets mixed with "thoughts" stored in
the memory!

Yet, incredibly, I "rebirth theories",
not only we expect this brain produced
'sense of me' to 'survive' - we also
expect this 'memory dependent' 'person'
to Survive! But, as we have seen in
numerous cases of brain damage,
'survival' of this 'persona' is solely
dependent of the survival of the
memory! When the memory is lost, part
of that 'person' [which is expected to
survive total physical death] dies in
this life itself!

In my opinion, what is often described
of as 'soul', is simply an 'ancient'
name given to the 'sense of identity'
produced by the brain! And, being only
a 'sense' produced by the 'physical
brain'; it can not survive the DEATH of
the brain!

***
'sense of 'person''; a 'mental'
'image' of me - this is also called I
called ahmakara [ego].

Adithya

"What can possibly get 'reborn'?", posted by Adithya

You think you are a leaf on a tree that thinks it is the leaf. It's a nice life, until some insect comes along to eat you, but then there are the ones who come along to eat the leaf-eaters. So the sun feels nice, and the wind and rain feels nice, and camaraderie with the many other leaves is like a community, and that feels nice. Life as a leaf is great. You have a sense of purpose, along with the other leaves, of water and carbon compounds flowing into you, and with the sun's energy, you provide energy to something bigger than what you think you are, the whole tree... and by extension, the whole earth, with that byproduct of photosynthesis. Then along comes fall of your life, and you for a moment turn so strong red... as the chlorophyll in you fades, then you yourself begin to fade, and slowly your connection to the tree fades. And you die, fall to the earth, you sleep and become the earth... to become, among other stuff, some carbon that the tree sucks up to leaves reborn in the spring.

On one of these endless cycles, a nearby leaf says to you, "My Beloved, you are not a leaf."

"Leaves don't talk."

"You just did."

"So... err... well, am I ... well, this tree?"

"If you want to be. But then you'd have a whole new game going, and I will someday say to you, 'My Beloved, you are not a tree.'"

The tone of the voice... the feeling aroused by being called "Beloved" caused the leaf to ponder quietly, a mild breeze playing. The leaf felt a warmth not just from the sun, and a memory returned. "I... I am, well, I am the Earth, then?"

"Then someday, when you've finished playing that game, I will tell you, 'My Beloved, you are not the Earth.'"

A cloud passed before the sun, but being called "Beloved" again brought back more memories. "I... I must be the sun. Is that right?"

"Then, when you've..."

"Yes yes, you will tell me..."

"Why did you cut me off? I so love to call you my Beloved. Good bye!"

***

The tree was now very very very old and tired. Lightning had often struck it and only a few gnarly branches produced leaves. It was not easy bringing water and minerals up from the earth, and the sun now burned. It senses that the coming winter will be its last.

A nearby tree says, "My Beloved, you are not a tree."

If a tree could cry, this one did. You cry, "Beloved, thank you for returning. Please tell me forever and a million times, everything I am not."

ARJ

Venky:Thank you for writing this book. I read this book and filled with gratitude for revealing many secrets of life and death.

Insight:Gosh, Chopra died and lived to tell about it.Next book will be on his Resurrection.
Stay tuned.

Manny: Aren't we all storytellers "Insight"?, some just tell a better story than others...

Deepak Chopra tells very good stories. And his stories make a lot of money. Problem is, (at least) some of the stories he tells in his books aren't true. Oh well, they make money. That’s one way the popularity of the stories can be measured and to be fair, Deepak Chopra does that best, IMO.

I did not read the book, “Life after Death” yet.

Here are some excepts from Deepak Chopra's recently published book, "Power, Freedom, and Grace" It's supposedly about Vedanta. Some major bloopers here. But hey, if it sells, who cares? Because if it sells, people get what they need.

From the front flap:

"Your essential being is the source of all being
the field of pure consciousness that manifests as
the entire universe. In this very moment,
pure consciousness illuminates and animates
your mind and body, and it is powerful,
invincible, unbounded, and free. When you know
yourself as this field of consciousness, you have
power to manifest your desires, you have
freedom from fear and limitations, and you
live in grace, which is that state of consciousness
where things flow and your desires are easily
fulfilled."

From chapter 1:

"When our life is an expression of the inner state
of happiness, we discover an immense reservoir of
power within us. This power gives us freedom from
fear and limitations, and allows us to realize all
the abundance that we aspire to. Even more significantly,
this power nurtures all of our relationships and makes
them truly fulfilling. We find ourselves becoming
beacons of light and love, and our very presence
nurtures the environment around us. People are drawn
to support our desires, and even nature responds
to our intentions.

The more we live in the state of happiness, the more
we experience the spontaneous fulfillment of desire
in the form of synchronicity and meaningful coincidence.
In many spiritual traditions, this has been called
the state of grace. To experience grace is to find
ourselves in the right place at the right time, to have
the support of the laws of nature, or good luck.

In the state of grace, it seems to us that the
universal or cosmic mind is eavesdropping on our
thoughts and fulfilling our intentions and desires even
as we are having them."

So roll, roll up!
Get enlightened!
Be in the right place at the right time!
Find friends and influence neighbors!
Get all your desires fulfilled!
Get your red hot grace here while it lasts!
Buy this book!

Self-knowledge this ain't folks.

Durga

Dear Durga,

Yes it's true Deepak mixes truth with myths but he does tell good stories. Oh well what can I say I like anyone that tells a good story fact or
fiction...

"Self-knowledge this ain't folks." ~Durga

...Couldn't have said it better myself. LOL.

Matthew

“Self-knowledge this ain't folks.” ~ Durga

”Couldn't have said it better myself.” ~ Matthew

well ok! just what aint right here?
i see nothing wrong...whay aint right?

dont worry...forget if u like i was just thinking od someone.. an old work colllegue - an indain fellow. he left our workplace and i think he went to london...i not sure...was just trying to think
if he went three...or back to india well he just came into mu mind for some reson..i not know why
the minds like that eh? well anyway....\i remmeber that i drove him home on his last night...he was nice guy, and i shook..or held his hand rather...and ibought my left hand to hold hand too..and he really apppreciated that...he respnded with almost tear in eye i see...and i was just thinking of how a nic guy he was...and asked my guru to bless him..i couldnt even rmemeber his mane.. and then i though t of how i felt a little wound up by your post...at your laughing...your ridicule of mr chopra. when what is see is a guy doing a lot of good. sure he make money...but that not necessarily mena bad and i thought of thse loving thoughts i had...and the thoughts of indignaion of righteous indignation tha i felt i rememeber last year writing someting of how i was going to try give up those thoughts...its a tricky one! but anyway.... i didnt like feeling little indignation..and sorry

sai

“Self-knowledge this ain't folks.” ~ Durga

”Couldn't have said it better myself.” ~ Matthew

“.. and then i though t of how i felt a little wound up by your post...at your laughing...your ridicule of mr chopra. when what is see is a guy doing a lot of good. sure he make money... ...but that not necessarily mena bad” ~Sai

..........If you read my post again (all 7 or so, depending on how you count, words of it) you may notice that there is no mention of his being nice or not nice, or whether he is or isn't doing good.
There is also no opinion mentioned about money. He is probably a very nice man, warm, even generous, possibly he even donates lots of money to wonderful charities. I am sure too that he makes life on this shit hole of a planet better for many people. That is a nice thing to do for people. However......Self-knowledge it aint.

Matthew

wel ok matthew. but i like i said peviously...i dont see anything that he said that conficts with self knowledge maybe phrased in a different styleto your pleasing...but when we get that out of the way...

Sai,

perhaps this is also an example of what you are referring to as simply a matter of style, but the part that conflicts with self-knowledge for me is Deepak Chopra’s words that essentially are saying the same thing as every bedtime story ever told to a child - "and you'll live happily ever after”.

It’s a sales pitch, a come on, a hook, whatever else you might want to call it.

in the paragraphs that Durga posted, he can't string two sentences together without saying, all of your desires will be fulfilled!

in this sentence below, e.g., he is promising power to manifest your desires, and later, in the same sentence he again says that your desires are easily fulfilled,

"When you know yourself as this field of consciousness, you have power to manifest your desires, you have freedom from fear and limitations, and you live in grace, which is that state of consciousness where things flow and your desires are easily fulfilled."

just to share a different point of view, my teacher, OTOH, asks things like,” why would you want to become enlightened, you might not like it”

and "why would you want to become enlightened, there’s nothing in it for you (i.e., the ego)?"

words like that of Deepak Chopra are offering are designed with one thing in mind - to get people to want what HE is offering, IOW, to fulfill his (material) desires, at least IMO.

YMMV,
clay

...everything material is supposedly capable of being divided into smaller and smaller parts - we can split the atom, supposedly the smallest particle of matter - but is the soul divisible ?

...if the soul is everything, then it can't be divided because it is everything...

...what about multiple personalities ?...is the soul the same and as distinctly different and unique as a personality..or is a "personality" simply a material "shape" that the soul occupies ??

...if the soul isn't divisible then we can't talk of individual souls...souls may be a fragment of something bigger, and individual consciousness is an illusion...

Nice post Ravi Swami…

“...if the soul isn't divisible then we can't talk of individual souls...souls may be a fragment of something bigger, and individual consciousness is an illusion...”

... the Ego and the identity of an individual consciousness (soul) cease to exist after the physical death. There remains only pure consciousness (Brahman)…

“You” don’t have an afterlife. Pure consciousness creates births and deaths according to the laws of the universe (known and unknown)…these births (call them individual souls or Atman) have the potential of its source Brahman, but they have limitations due to the biological body they possess. When their biological bodies die, they become one with “pure consciousness” and lose their individual identities with their bodies.

To believe that we have an Afterlife is the work of the Ego, which doesn’t want to lose its identity. If you truly believe in “I AM” then “I” in you is the same as the “I” in your neighbor. The birth of a new “I” from the womb of a mother doesn’t have any identity but that of “pure consciousness”.

"Simply Enough"

Leave well enough alone.
Always despise "not good enough".
Enjoy enough? Well...yes!
Loathe "not enough".
Love enough.

Be thankful if you have enough.
Well...I've had enough of this!
Enough already! Enough! Enough!
There's enough for everyone.
Take some, have some, it's good for you!

Now...are you enough?
Or should you be "more than enough"?
How can you be "more than enough"?

That I am, simply is enough.
Thus, what I am now is enough.
I am enough! Love enough!

You don't need to be "more than enough",
The Universe will always be That!
Enough is enough!
"Please have enough," Nuff said!

Inspired by John 8:58
October 5, 2002
Me2

Life After Death
Scientists say that entire universe was
born out of a singularity. It progressed
from hydrogen to helium to oxygen and
water and then eventually bacteria,
viruses and humans too were born!
Scientists further state that universe
will eventually go back to a singularity Again!
Or else expand forever into darkness and death
… a philosopher’s nightmare.

I wonder what that tells about all the
rebirth 'stories' and, about the 'life
after death'!
But, then, I think all these 'stories'
have this concept of 'waiting' one can
be 'waiting' for eons to take birth -
and, I wonder how 'painful' such
'waiting' might be - and, then just
when you though you had a womb, a
potential mother and a potential 'life'
- your mother decides to 'abort'! That
could be Quite Painful indeed!
But, luckily, I think all these
'stories' are mostly just
'speculations' and, in reality, no one
really has any real clue about it!
I think ultimately science is the only
one that can answer the question of
"life", "death", 'life after death' and
'rebirth' and so far, even science has
no real answer for any of these!
Adithya
Dear Adithya,
I like your thought.
I am asking a question to these scientists, philosophers and new age gurus that
Why??????????????? In history of mankind, when a Buddha goes beyond body and mind or realizes the truth, normally they laugh to the world and to themselves?
None of these scientists, philosophers and new age gurus has even guts to answer.
What I can tell you is, Meditation is the only solution.
The techniques of meditation can give only who is realized. Buddha 2500 years ago has given the meditation technique and we know how many realize the truth.
Biggest gift to the world in this century is OSHO. Don’t miss the opportunity.
Each womb (Baby) born with the greatest possibility to realize truth, not to become politicians, philosophers, scientist, great thinker, new age gurus, authors and so on…

Looks like TT is closest. Yet there could be a continuity of essence that One can tune into.

But perhaps as I have said before you are merely witnessing the unfolding of event that you understand as you.

Like I AM saying I AM everyone that ever was and will be, even the most hideous of my characters, I AM thee.

But as I watch TV I see a world of ego, in it's most idiotic form, could we not refine one's characters with some wisdom an intelligence?

I mean I am all about experience, and I see my self in many places not having a good one, and this must change.

It is my One will that all of the earth changes.

So watch "out" what you are watch "in" is going to change.

Resist and you encounter turmoil and a troubling experience.

Flow and you encounter harmony and the most amazing experience.

No matter how long I live, I only live right now.

Actually you live in the past.

You are the present.

~Richard Thomas

In other words you cannot live "in" the present.

You can only Be the present.

yo, thanks Richard for the correction.....

No matter how long I am, I am right now....much better...

yo, thanks Richard for the correction.....

No matter how long I am, I am right now....much better...

Where is the voice of Science?

Where the brain of science?

Science is but a poor substitute of a human being who does not have the temerity to so speak for her or him self and claim responsibility for doing so.

Tony

Folks say Science tells us this, or Science says that.
I have been looking for this fellow called Science for years.
All I meet is hearsay; what other fellows say what Science says.
I say:- “Science, tell me yourself; otherwise shut the fuck up.”

Tony

Might I add that this also applies to “Enlightenment, awareness, (be it pure or not).”
Tony
(again) !

Science is the gift that gave the possibility to communicate in the
way you just did...

ARJ

Science is not static, with everyday it is progressing. It is like an eternal art work which is yet incomplete. Scientific inquiry goes on. The work of science, physics and mathematics is no different than the work of spirituality... it is simply to make sense of, or come to terms with, or (in its positive side) to bring ease, comfort and some kind of understanding/acceptance to life.

There is no opposition between the aims o f science and spirituality, and in acquiring knowledge or enlightenment, unless the mind that perceives the opposition feels somehow threatened and puts a barrier there.

love, Heather

I've been around this world
I've been a lot of places
Seen a million faces
In a thousand towns
But when I looked into your eyes
I knew I found Heaven
And I've been wantin' to tell you
I never wanna let you go

It may be winter & heat on
But what I'm feeling is summer in my heart

[Chorus]
Is it too familiar to say "I love you"
Would you be suspicious if I asked your name
Tell me, what would it take
to really convince you
that I'm gonna love you
even if my heart would break

I see a better day
I can feel it coming
I can hear it calling
in the winter night
Could you turn this man
into a true believer
when you left your traces
on that moonlit night

It may be winter & heat on
But when I'm with you, with you
It's summer in my heart

[Repeat chorus]

[Kenny G sax solo]

It may be winter & heat on
But when I'm with you, with you
It's always summer in my heart

So let the mountains tumble
Tumble to the sea
Let the rivers overflow
It won't bother me
Let the stars go out tonight
Cuz I can see them in your eyes
And I wanna love you
even if my heart would break
(Even if my heart would break)

[Repeat chorus]

Even if my heart would break
I'm gonna love you
Even if my heart would break
I'm gonna love you
Let the stars go out tonight
Cuz I can see them in your eyes
And I'm gonna love you
even if my heart would break

(Even if my heart would break)
(Even if my heart would break)
(Even if my heart would break)
Yeah, yeah
(Even if my heart would break)
I'm gonna love you
Even if my heaaarrrt would break
(Even if my heart would break)
(Even if my heart would break)

~Kenny G/Aaron Neville

Older people, know this..
song, without,
legal, ..;)

Love, Passion,

Tony wrote:

“Where is the voice of Science?”

-Where is the voice of God?
Some claim to be fighting wars on his behalf.

“Where the brain of science?”
-Where is the brain of religion?

“Science is but a poor substitute of a human being who does not have the temerity to so speak for her or him self and claim responsibility for doing so.
Tony”

-Religion is a poor excuse not to investigate what isn't understood, and a great opportunity to create authority out of thin air, followed by discrimination, repression, exploitation.

If anything, it shows that those having inspired religions, weren't aware of the consequences. IOW, in contradiction with claims like "omniscience".

Jan

"Science is the gift that gave the possibility to communicate in the
way you just did..." ~ARJ

.........You mean via computer and the internet?

A gift like a Trojan Horse is more like it.

Matthew

Dear everyone

I am the real Heather, and I have not commented on IB for 2+ days, and I won't be commenting for some time, except for this note.

Anything signed Heather or Heath with the hgquinn or heather typekey ID's are from IBRH, until I write a new comment to say I am back again.

If you know me, you'll know enough about my syntax, style and spirit to recognize my real words when I come back.

Dear IBRH

The views you wrote in your comment 44 above could well be my own. Cheers to you. It is beautifully felt and written, too.

Dear Marek

Here's an old song by Leon Russell that used to make me cry. It still does, when I hear Leon's version. (Elton John covered it a couple of years ago, but if you can find Leon singing it, it's worth the search, his voice is raw with drink and truth.) ...

A Song For You

I've been so many places
in my life and times
I've sung a lot of songs
I've made some bad rhymes

I've acted out my love on stages
with ten thousand people watching
but we're alone now
and I'm singing this song to you

I know your image of me
is what I hope to be
I've treated you unkindly
but darling can't you see

there's no one more important to me
darling can't you please see through me
'cause we're alone now
and I'm singing this song to you

You taught me precious secrets
of truth, witholding nothing,
you came out in front
when I was hiding

but now I'm so much better
and if my words don't hold together
listen to the melody
'cause my love is there, hiding

I love you in a place
where there's no space and time
I love you for my life
you are a friend of mine

and when my life is over
remember when we were together
we were alone
and I was singing this song to you
...

love, Heath

Science gave me nothing at all.

I see a computer screen before me!

Where is science when I need the fellow, ARJ, Heather?

You must know of his whereabouts.

Tell him (or her) to come out into the open and face the music.

Tony

ARJ, Heather, Tony and everyone,

It's amazing in our day, how so many feel that there is a conflict between scientific inquiry and spiritual inquiry.

I am reminded of a well-known televangelist a few years ago, who publicly decried as satanic everything about science... broadcasting that statement live with the latest in satellite digital transmission.

Some of the most deeply spiritual people I know are agnostic scientists... people who are not afraid to always question everything, especially their own methods and motivations.

In the sentence I wrote below, I would easily substitute "tool" with "gift." I prefer "gift" because one should really respect the tools science can reveal. That became quite clear for Einstein and many others who worked on the Manhattan Project after Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

ARJ

Oh my! I meant Adithya, not ARJ..not refering myself!

A boy once went to Hallow’s eve
To find the ghost of his uncle Steve
As he crept amongst the still of dawn
A monstrous creature moaned a mighty Yawn

He was frozen still by the flaming sight Of a horrid creature that had taken to flight There were flames of darkness flames of light As he tried to hide himself out of sight

He was thrown to the ground and charred with burn Until along came a squirrel all red and stern Who took ground beside him and would never turn

Back now to the darkness thou shalt sharp return As the night is descending and thou is interred By Skylight and moonlight thee is not friend And soon it will burn thee beyond that of mend.

Be gone to the darkness and not to return Until the night of darkness is again once returned All Hallows Eve is ended by far!
And rolls away beat to a distance far

Until this time when the squirrel burns red will our souls meet again on the night of the dead.

Never believe again that you grieve for Uncle Steve For he was the squirrel so feared and believed.

I could go on forever writing this yarn
But always remember the squirrel of dawn

When you are lying alone in your bed
The spirit of Uncle Steve will never be dead As long as you keep me alive in your head And when night has fallen and darkness has spread

Remember the squirrel who's courage never fled!

I wrote that just now off the top of my head what do you think??

Love Simon xx

Deepak, I attended your presentation in Phoenix on 10/27 and it was superb!! However, I have a lingering question from that presentation. If our soul resides in the "offs" along with all other energetic beings in an infinite continum what precludes other entities from sharing the "ons" in what may be called possession?
Roger

That song posted above,
have no idea who wrote it,
but sure made me,
speechless,

Love,

I have to say that I'm impressed that Deepak would post this for free. I haven't been able to read all the comments here, but I get the feeling we are all on the same page. I was told a long time ago (during a yoga session) that I was to be my own guru. It was a voice in my head, I cried, probably realizing how much harder this was going to make searching for the truth. Stories such as these always help to realign my awarness and bring to me another little bit of the story I hold in my head, concerning this life and what I'm contributing to it, the world and humanity. thanx for your time hope to write again.
There are 'no organized spirits'

I would like to make everyone here aware, that whoever has used the pseudonym "ARJ" in the above listed commentaries actually "stole" them from where I and many other similar ones wrote them from another site. I have only a few minutes ago become a member here, only for the purpose really, of making this "identity theft" aware to the other members here. I, as "ARJ" never - and I assume the same goes for several other identities here - posted them here, and to make matters worse, what is represented as being written by me, "ARJ", and perhaps others, is not whole nor in the context of the discussion from which it originated in within that other forum, where I am a member.

If I truly make a comment here, it will be under the name "ARJ-BL" which is how I just now registered here, since it seems the thief has himself registered here as ARJ. I am too busy in my life to get involved in a whole debate here as to why this is so, and it comes as a bit of shock to me.

Best wishes to everyone debating here,
ARJ ... or as I now have to do it, ARJ-BL