I think there is a relevant piece written about two years ago on this.

On the rise Apostasy

Click my name.

Howdy there, Deepak!

Good to see you again! Come and chat someday when you can

allow yourself some free-time for spontaneous eruptions.

.

Ecumenical means: the inhabited world comes together

Evangelical means: there are souls out there needing to be saved

by the blood of the lamb and a thorough baptism!

(not to be confused with threatening to drown)

I mean...how clean can you get with a few sprinkles?

"Drench the sinner, condemn the sin," as they say.

Let's get wet and wild anyway! In 10,000 years who will care?

That was funny Keith! I suppose I should laugh, but I cannot help it.

BTW: I liked Deepak's write-up and just maybe all this will take care of itself in time. It is hard to watch and hear about tho...

Love, Char

I believe the first baptism is the physical birth of a child from its mother's womb, which is why John the Baptism was able to baptism as a representation of our physical birth, as he prepared the way for Jesus who baptism with the Fire of Spirit. This Spirit Fire was also a representation of union with God and it does not have to be done physically, but was and is done so as to represent what is happening within an individual. Spirit is known among those who have the highest level of development, such as Deepak, i.e., Spirit is the truth and it shines like a beacon for all to see. We all recognize this Spirit within ourselves and others as it is our common ground of being, but many do not understand it.

Love, Char

i.e., we all know a lie when we see one. But some of us have to look a little harder, since most of the time, one just knows and feels it within their heart and soul, so they search for the light or truth. It's all part of the process of becoming enlightened and we will all get there in due time, since not one will be left behind...NOT ONE, as all the parts make the BODY whole. This is the one SON (or SUN, i.e., LIGHT).

Love, Char

No, publicly converting individuals of other faiths to Catholicism is not the way to build bridges!

Quite the contrary, such displays only serve to enrage staunched believers and create a wider gap.

As to question of what lies ahead: "return of the ecumenical spirit or, at the opposite end, the final triumph of secular rationalism?" The way I see it, neither method will work.

I have learned that as explained in the book "The Third Christ", God is not something that one seeks and finds, GOD is! God by any other name is still GOD.

When you live your life from a position of Love, God manifests in your life.

ACCEPTANCE is the key!

...so in short, we have all been baptized by the Spirit, if one believes that we are spirit, which is the breath of God that flutters everywhere, as we inhale H20 from the day we were born from our mothers wombs - God held us first with the Breath, as our Mothers gave us H2O from her blood. It's all the same regardless how one looks at it. God loves everyone equally in the whole wide world. However, those at a lower consciousness need to rise and it cannot be done thru ignorance - it can only be done within, as each of us must rise above the darkness and lies that were told to us due to others misunderstanding of Spirit/God/Self. So maybe now, the LIGHT is shining brighter.

Hey, Keith, I know you really liked it when I said, "I AM pouring out My oil upon the whole wide world." Spirit/God is anointed everyone and it's being done quickly and powerfully, i.e., for those still in ignorance or darkness. :-)

Love, Char

Yes, I know I'm in too big of a hurry so sorry for all the English language errors. I'll blame it on all my allergy meds and my boss just yelling at me!

Love, Char

Islam, Catholicism, Baptisism...Pope....boring.:)

Dr. Chopra,

As you say, John Paul II dismissed any claim that Buddha was Christlike and that from a Catholic viewpoint, Buddhists are all pagans. Pope Benedict went so far as to say that Catholicism is the only true Christianity and demeaned the Protestant followers of the faith.

These positions are prime examples of intolerance and a lack of recognition that the important focus of religions should be on the true brotherhood of man and on Unity.

Father Malachi Martin, former Jesuit and professor at the Vatican's Pontifical Biblical Institute and expert on the Catholic Church has said that the true last message given at Fatima has been hidden from the people by the church.

It appears that there is a focus on control of church members and an attitude of exclusivity followed by the Catholic leaders.

"Betsy" S.

"leading to the most powerful insurgent movement of the late 20th century, right-wing fundamentalism"

With statements like this, I'm sure Deepak you will get many more invites to Dubai!

Nice twist calling "right wing Christians... insurgents.

Boy can we use a Third Jesus, more than ever.

Mucho moral lunacy

Cheers,

Steve

The vacuum in Europe will be and is being filled by Muslims, the passive and otherwise.

Look at birthrates and open door immigration, it's simple math.

I wish Pope Benedict well on his trip to the US.

I wonder if this isn't all too many spiritual and religious headliners clawing away at top billing?

Steve

Hi Deepak,

Along the line of quenching ones thirst:

Seattle is hosting His Holiness the Dalai Lama this week with a Seeds of Compassion event. Thousands of children, families and community members are attending a variety of sessions. Tomorrow I will be one of them.

Here are the topics at point:

* The Scientific Basis for Compassion: What We Know Now with His Holiness the Dalai Lama

His Holiness the Dalai Lama is joined by a panel of leading researchers to discuss the quantitative benefits of compassion.

Moderated by Daniel Goleman, author of “Emotional Intelligence”

Panelists:

Richard Davidson, Director, Laboratory of Affective Neuroscience
Alicia Lieberman, President, Board of Directors, Zero to Three
Daniel J Seigel, Author of "The Mindful Brain" and "Parenting from the Inside Out"
Andrew Meltzoff, Co-Director, UW Institute for Learning and Brain Sciences

* His Holiness the Dalai Lama will be joined by leaders in the area of compassion and empathy for a wide ranging discussion of how parents and educators can bring compassion into the lives of children and families.

Moderated by Mark Greenberg, Director of Prevention Research Center for the Promotion of Human Development at Penn State

Panelists:

John Gottman, Author of "How to Raise an Emotionally Intelligent Child"
Mary Gordon, Roots of Empathy
Roger Weissberg, President of the Collaborative for Academic, Social, and Emotional Learning (CASEL)
Karen Gordon, Whole Child International
Bob Marvin, Co-Originator, Circle of Security

* Concert for Compassion: An Acoustic Evening with Dave Matthews and Tim Reynolds

Dave Matthews and Tim Reynolds will be performing in celebration of the historic visit to Seattle of His Holiness the Dalai Lama and other compassion leaders to bring global attention to the importance of nurturing kindness and compassion in the world, starting with children and all those who touch their lives.

Trish~~

People need to believe in themselves. (keith?) Who is going to let them? Popes, nah! Deepak....

Thought for the 10,000year day!

#9 Ruthie..... :)

Hi there, Char4!

Have we seen you lately? What gives?

Even though I don't know your last name,

my guess is...you haven't changed in years!

I mean that in a good-spirited way, for you are a rock.

I am a TREE. How in the world will we ever come together for tea?

Luvz and hugz! Keith/UT/Me2/El Tardo

Keith, just speak to your sister.

She knows a fine juggler who says he learnt all the flicks of the wrist from you.

You're the business, man. Please forgive me for speaking in your tongues or in code of some sort.

Edmund C

EEK humanists....what a shame!

The only thing Pope Benedict needs to do is declare war on all of those wretched Protestant heretics!

Amen!

We are still in the ecumenical age simply because, as you point out, people who are tolerant of other belief systems outnumber the fundamentalists at least 4 to 1. Some fundies are very wealthy, so some politicians cater to them, but that's about where it tops out. That's where Mike Huckabee topped out on the Presidential race. If what religion someone is was a defining value for electing a President, Huck would currently be the GOP nominee. Instead they have McCain, who probably fits your definition as a casually religious person, even though he is a political conservative.

Fundy groups seem to rise while they can hide themselves, but generally the public repudiates them when they are exposed, and in democracies, the public tends to vote them back down if they start interfering too much in the national political process.

The other thing that strikes me in your post is that you apparently hold the belief that Buddha was pretty much like Jesus.

I think the historical documentation of the Buddha's life (something that is strikingly lacking in the case of Jesus) shows that he wasn't much like Jesus at all.

The Buddha did not perform miracles, he never (let me repeat NEVER, not once) mentioned believing in God or saying he was sent by God to help humanity. No one proclaimed the Buddha as a messiah, and no one prophesied his coming. He was not a product of a magical supernatural birth.

The Buddha had deep spiritual insights and taught non-violence and meditation, and apparently Jesus was non-violent and taught prayer, as well as apparently went through a period of ascetic practices in his life.

But many Westerners think that Buddha was the Jesus of Buddhism, and that is simply not the case. Buddhism doesn't have a Jesus any more than Christianity has a Buddha.

Careful Yogi, you might be bringing too much common sense to this post and will upset the norm.

Steve

Deepak,

I saw "time" yesterday. I observed it through senses and consciousness. The context was earthy soil. Time was spread out before me in a field of daffodils. Some of the yellow flowers were faded, wilted, discolored. Others were if their full blossom beauty. Still others were just starting to open. Time is a field singing it's song. Today I have a bouquet of time singing in a vase of clear water. Time gives us many gifts through nature. Time grounds us in Nature. Nature grounds us in time.

Time gives birth and it is up to us to celebrate it not dissect it. And at the same time I value masculine angles of logical dissection. However, male angles have held dominant control for too long and must soften and yield to include new feminine ways of seeing/hearing/being. Why? Evolution.

And at the same time feminine angles need to change and expand to include new masculinity. Why? Evolution.

We are at an opportune time - a pivotal point - for each part that was separate to now embrace the other. Time celebrates this union in brain/body.

Trish~~

WOW, yogi-one, that was good, not boring at all.

I think most people who tend to gear toward an enlightenment, or a Self-realization perspective such as what Buddha represents will presume that that's what Jesus was also teaching even though the "stories," the allegorical language used to describe the life, actions and sayings of Jesus were and are misunderstood by his believers and taken to be literal or fact.

For many spiritual seekers the Jesus factor is rejected because of those very misunderstandings handed down through different religions but after coming to understand the perspective of enlightenment or Self realization then say ahhh....so that is what Jesus was talkin bout......knowing many folks who have left different religious beliefs, not, one, I think, has ever referred to the Buddha as being like Jesus, but, have, in fact, said something like..."so that is what Jesus was saying...teaching...behind all that allegorical stuff." I think more people who "seek" have more trouble understanding the "Jesus" factor and not until they understand the teachings of Buddha do they go back and are able to embrace a Jesus figure.

have a great day ruth...

Yes Yogi, you know how conservatives like Norm are frightened by such free-thinking . . .

Rah rah rah (or, har har har, whichever works)!

Not to make fun of wayward IBers.

pax vobiscum

Deepak is correct.

Islam and Christianity, the old texts, organized religion; are no longer relevant or pertinent.

God is on the planet having taken to flesh in multiple instances.

It is taking over the planet.

Or hasn't anyone noticed?

The fictions of man and anything that depends upon them will not last long.

Wayward could mean towards the way the truth and the Life O'Reilly.
Some people get Life in prison. Some people get a joke. What the world doesn't get, a joke disguises back to it, a riddle plays havoc with the world and should be put inside. It's outside the truth and wraps it all up when the onion is all said and done.
A riddle takes out the lumpy bits and stops the rest from getting stoned, Sieve I care when the sands of time run out. I am the way out kid.

Dear Dr. Chopra,

I have recently been reading a lot about the ancient wisdom that has long been missing in the present day teachings of both religion and science.

I just happened upon an especially fascinating bit of information about how the original teachings of Christianity have been omitted from our current theological guidelines.

In the second century Emperor Tertullian removed much information from the gospels which referred to the esteemed place of women as fellow disciples of the faith. It is reported that he had quite a hatred for women.

Christ honored the Sacred Partnership of both men and women disciples. His teachings maintained the long held teachings of the Sacred Partnership which represented God in Us as the combination of both Positive and Negative (Male and Female) Polarities. In Canonical Gospels Mary Magdalene is listed eight times as the only esteemed woman who travelled with Jesus.

The modern church has been able to suppress the knowledge about the esteemed place of women during the ministry of Jesus. In fact, the church has tried to completely destroy the image of women as important teachers of the faith. An example of this is the portrayal of Mary Magdalene as a "fallen woman". The church leaders must have felt that this stance was necessary in order for them to gain the most control possible.

Through the ages there has been much loss of "Light", the Sophia or Wisdom, which was so valued by original followers.

"Betsy" S.

I just got back from hearing His Holiness speak in Seattle. My friends were drumming on the "procession of cultures" in the opening ceremonies. I was happy to see at least one local Chinese organization out in their formal colors celebrating his presence.

I don't know what to say...it's the closest I'll get to darshan since Osho has left his body. When he namasted and I namasted back from the audience that peaceful rush I haven't felt in over a decade surged through my body.

His speech was amazing. At 72, he didn't drop a beat or miss a single important point regarding the correct practice of compassion in leadership roles.

And yes, he touched on how women are aquiring more leadership roles in society and how important it is for society to have gender balance in leadership roles. Washington Governor Christine Gregoire sat next to him paying rapt attention. I just hope she was drinking it in and even a little bit of his style rubs off on her.

I have been to a lot of talking head ceremonies and we all know how the energy gets by about the third speaker.

But they all kept their spiels short, and when His Holiness spoke, you could have heard a pin drop in a stadium with 50,000 people. Everybody's rapt attention was focused on him, and he was laying the stuff down straight from the heart of compassion.

I have heard great spiritual speakers, and I have heard many sharp political analyses, but to see a man who has a mastery of both realms, and delivers it in the peaceful, yet powerful way which he spoke was something I had never seen before.

He is the living example of the kind of leader we need in the world, and I sincerely hope everyone in a leadership position who comes in contact with him takes his example as a model of how to get it right.

There were many great musicians there too. One young lady (age 11) played a crisp rendition of a Mozart Sonata, and he garlanded her with a scarf right there on the stage. Amazing. Imagine being 11 years and performing with His Holiness sitting 10 feet away from you in a chair. Then he garlands you. Wow!

All the different cultures of Washington, as well as musics from around the world were represented, and the theme was centered around educating and helping children to grow into compassionate leaders themselves.

Oh, yeah, and someone hired a private plane to fly over the stadium with a rider that said "Dalai Lama stop supporting riots."

It looked so horribly out of place that I just had to shake my head in disbelief.

The ecumenical spirit can survive when in the hearts of men, all wish to be one with one another.