Hello Deepak and Everyone,

Happy 4th.....I was thinking about renting the video of HBO's John Adams but after looking it over(it is three DVDs) I will not have time to watch them all so I decided to get the book it was based on instead(library)....I love to read...

Deepak you write, "Can the America public be weaned off soundbites, slogans, trivial distractions, gossip, and smear campaigns with no basis in fact? For the first time in forty years, it does seem possible."

I do not understand what you mean by that..

I think this Nation, has, since, our earliest beginnings, dealt with all of the above during political campaigns and I doubt it will end just ecause Barak Obama has entered the arena.

But, I think you are forgetting a very important fact that there are folks...a close estimate would be anywhere from 40 to 50 million people who vote for the candidate that they are quite content with, who share the same ideas and values as they do....such as the 51 million who voted for President Bush, but they are not being hoodwinked they are liking the politics and policies of that Candidate(yeah, I know, it is hard to believe that folks vote because they actually LIKE a McCain, Bush, or Cheney, but they do.) Really look at our two "homie republicans" here at IB...Ambasteve and Norm....they LOVE their guys, wouldn't be caught alive voting for a LIBERAL...

So, yes, image does play a part and it always will but I think people's personal taste plays more of a part in their voting decisions.

If Barak Obama wins over McCain it will be because the past Administration has really dropped their "republican" ball, let their voters down, afterall, most Democrats voted for the other guy and they will not vote for McCain, if Barak Obama loses Democrats it will mean that folks will have nothing to do with the new guy on the block....if he loses Republicans it means the Republicans are still Republicans and will vote accordingly and that they are not unhappy with the situation. I do not think any thinking, awake, American really believes that it is possible to win the Iraq war. No matter how long we stay in Iraq...10, 20, 30 years....there will be those who will not rest until all those Yankees go home...The American people understand when they are not wanted while our Government just doesn't care whether they are wanted or not....but we know..we will NEVER be wanted in Iraq. I do not know what is going to happen to our billion dollar Embassy...you just know there is a bomber somewhere who has their sights set on it...so I really am confused by our building such a freak show of an Embassy in the first place....but heck we are Americans and we do love to waste billions....

Deepake you write, "The 2004 election was an exercise in mass hypnosis, whereby the Bush administration, freighted with overwhelming deceit and failure, sailed to victory on images of fear, in particular al-Qaeda."

I do not agree that they won because of mass hypnosis...they won because there were those voters who like the job they were doing...maybe some where voting out of fear but I think most were voting their politics.

Even in my extended family...I cannot believe the Bush/Cheney voters, they would have nothing to do with Kerry, or Gore or Barak Obama...and, well, they just love me inspite of my liberal, democratic bent...

so I think Barak Obama can win some republican votes but I think it will only be those who are very let down by Bush/Cheney..he will lose some Democratic votes because of inexperience and or color the same with independents...but there will be a strong republican vote because that is who they like and even a bad image for McCain will not deter them...

have a great 4th everyone.....ruth

I still think the elections are a dog-and-pony show.

The public is locked out of the behind-the-scenes deal-making and policy-making. Any candidate who will actually stimulate more than small increments of change is eliminated from contention early on.

Media-bytes have always been with us from the days of the patriot pamphleteers and political satirists that were part of the political scene even before the US became a country.

The pamphleteers and cartoonists leveraged the cutting edge media technology of their day (the revolution of mass printing), just as today's campaign managers and political commentators leverage computers, TV, radio, and the internet (arguably just mass publishing on a much bigger scale than the printing presses were able to do).

And it's the same old story. My candidate is a paragon of virtue, your candidate kills babies, etc, etc.

Meanwhile, the people who control who can actually access the White House are furiously protecting the status quo, and while they may realize that the time's are a-changing, they are not interested in too much change anytime too soon. That was true in 1808, and it's true in 2008.

Obama, like McCain, has been reduced to doing and saying whatever wins the campaign. For McCain, it means stuff like opposing the McCain-Feingold campaign finance reform measures that he co-authored (how's that for a flip-flop par excellence?)

For Obama, it means you can no, longer be a guest speaker at the local Palestinian group's annual dinner, and instead have to declare your allegiance to AIPAC,
or voting FOR telecom immunity just six months after issuing public statements that you were 'firmly opposed' to any measure that grants telecom immunity.

I honestly don't know what either one of them stands for anymore.

Their images join the parade of roast-beef sandwiches, cars, toothpaste, and whatever else we're being sold on the tube.

Candidates are products, but even worse. There has to be some truth in advertising of actual products, but for politicians? Hey, they voted themselves immune from truth-in-advertising legislation!

That's right - politicians are NOT obligated to truthfully represent themselves to you in ad campaigns.

Now go vote - except your vote doesn't matter unless you live in Ohio, Florida, or a couple of other swing states. And they got ways to make sure your vote won't count them either. You're address isn't quite right, or your fingerprints aren't available, or you change school districts, or you moved from a different county or state, or you...the list of disqualifiers goes on and on. But that's OK, you can still use our trusty DIEBOLD voting machines that WERE NEVER FIXED since the last botched election.

No wonder people like Robert Mugabe laugh in our face when we criticize his elections. He just figures it's easier to just kill off your opponents and their supporters than go through all the left-handed hoopla we have here to rig an election.

Soundbites and slogans like "war on terrorism", trivial distractions like not wearing a flag pin on your lapel, gossip and smear campaigns like some young starlet fooling around with a candidate, etc...are images that can stay on people's minds...if you're not aware of them.

So, for the first time, in a long time, Barack Obama is able to toss them off and lead people to focus more on the issues at hand, to think more deeply and ask real questions.

Would Americans vote for war if they know that it is going to kill a lot of people and that it will not do any good anyway? No, they voted for war because they were filled with fear of terrorism.

Does wearing a flag pin means you are patriotic and that if you do not wear one you are not patriotic? I think that's idiotic. What's patriotism anyway? It only divides people.

>> "It's morning in America."

I live in New Zealand, and even i find that phrase empowering

Man that's just scary

Hello Deepak and Everyone,

Reading Deepak's blog and then yogi-one's comment I have to laugh, Deepak is "in love" with Barak Obama so you can't expect an objective write-up from him and yogi-one is just plain disgusted with the whole election process...

Deepak I hate to tell you this but your writings about Barak are as much about image making as anyones it is just that your image of Barak Obama is the innocent virgin image, he is the "black knight" of truth justice and the American way in your image portrait...this is the image you have outlined and you have many here at IB who buy it with you, but, image it is, you have just decided to ignore Barak Obama, the ambitious political "male" candidate who can use his "Jesus is my Saviour" reference whenever possible and I am sure using that reference gets a vote or 10 coming his way...but I am curious about him referring to his "Jesus is my Saviour" line...I must admit that him saying that many more times than I have been comfortable hearing it, by a political candidate, bothers me. I wonder why it is necessary for him to constantly refer to his "being saved" by Jesus. Usually, the only folks who use the term that way are folks who feel it necessary to try to save others, bring them round, if you will, to "the saving."....I bet you haven't even noticed his saying this, making this reference, you are so "in love" with him and I am sure it doesn't even matter to you, but it does bother me...and, now, his use of faith-based organizations is also a bit bothersome to me also....the line between church and state is thick, for me, very thick.

Anyway, it is clear that you have been making and continue to make Barak Obama into an image and likeness that you NEED to worship...right now. I do understand the need our political reality is not all it is cracked up to be....by either side...

have a great day everyone, ruth

Dear Deepak,

""In the current presidential race, the ability of images to paralyze thought has to be dismantled, because a rising China, uncontrolled oil prices, global warming, and terrorism were spun into image problems instead of real ones. The 2004 election was an exercise in mass hypnosis, whereby the Bush administration, freighted with overwhelming deceit and failure, sailed to victory on images of fear, in particular al-Qaeda.""

Every book and every article and everything that is produced by media is an exercise in (mass) hypnosis, sometimes positive sometimes negative.
Mass hypnosis is indoctrination. It has come so far already that every opinion that is given on whatever subject is given in order to convince someone else.

As long as people are led by indoctrination, nothing will change.

Even Obama lets himself get indoctrinated.

I wonder if it is possible at all to be totally empty of thought and image.

One cannot meditate all day and, no matter how ONE we are supposed to be, we still do express our thoughts and opinions, in fact everything in life, in a myriad of ways.

Perhaps on the Moon it is quiet enough lol But also there not for long anymore!

So at the end, in my humble opinion one cannot do much more than let it be and hope that Obama really will be able to let whatever image fade away..... :)

Love, Mieke

Yup, Ruth I especially like this "He is by any reasonable judgment a far superior candidate" give it a rest will ya, what makes him this? cause you like him? I like him too, but please you sound like a proud papa, or brain washed.

Talking about images......

Very good tennis match going on at the moment between the sisters Williams.

Wonder what images they have in their mind?

:)

Mieke

Oh man... such a noise in the U.S.A right now. I've been close to a football stadion once and it sounded something like this :)

Dear American brothers and sisters, you have made your election campaigns into noisy hysterical entertainment, may the best man win, fight till death do us part and all the rest, everyone starts with popcorn and expectations but half the public ends up cheering and half of it cursing when the match is over.

In all that noise... is anyone listening to the guidance, the knowingness, the simple truths whispered by the intelligence of the human race, the only voice that can be trusted to show us the way to life and evolution? If you are, I hope you can hear anything... it's not easy. But it's possible.

I do not know much about what your two candidates say or what is on their agenda. But it's easy to tell which choice means going forward and which backward. It doesn't mean that any of your candidates is perfect (meaning spotless, only good or whatever). But one is perfect to let life go on, the other perfect to stop its flow. And if you listen inside, you'll know which is which :))

Aloha Deepak and Everyone

Someone who had a NDE, was sharing the other side is not what it is made out to be and anyone would give anything for our worst day here on Earth. We are given so many possibilities. And another person was sharing about being in a monastery where they had all these round balls, like Christmas ornaments hanging from the ceiling and when questioned it was for those who are dimensionally blind and would like to see like monks in their altered state of consciousness. So when my front fender became crushed from hitting a garbage can, I had to smile because I too, am third dimensional blind.

The earth is made up of perceptions.. that is her beauty. What is government, loose collation of bureaucracy? We manifest from wisdom:) of self-governing, we have the knowledge we live in a world of fractals and not to buy the three dimensional masquerade of images because there are always good car garages. love patty

Sacred Feminine speaks through images.

We had lost our hearing and seeing and didn't know how to find Her. We had turned away from Her in our fast paced, materialistic, academic, scientific and technological off-balance spin.

Her voice increases in volume as systems crash and humans discover that happiness is not found in outer values.

Her voice resounds through Nature. How many times a day does one appreciate the elements and those elemental sparks of light beings behind the veil of matter? Or is one too busy, too sophisticated mentally or too citified to attune with Nature?

Her voice says: "Be still...turn within...listen...receive inspiration...appreciate the magic..reflect Her in the outer world..spread joy...beautify...make peace.

Her images speak from a cosmic archetypal labyrinth that bypass mind and emotion yet include both.

She partners with He...another chapter in the story of co-creation and unity.

She is breaking through everywhere...do you see the signs? If so, you part of Her expression.

We see what we express. The outer is a reflection of the inner.

Trish~~

Where you mad/angry about something? What? crashing your car? did this help?

Aloha Tammy

Actually I was tired. And of course it was a awakening experience:) Imagine our worst day is Heaven's best. My son in-law is going to ask his friend if my car's fender can be pounded out, other wise they will replace it. The garbage container was unharmed of course:) Mahlao for your interest. love patty

Bravo! Beautiful image, Trish, on #11. Well said and described.

I like beautiful images like flowers, rainbows, sunsets, arts, descriptions of images like #11 above. Nothing wrong with images...except those that come from fear and violence....

Hmmm...sigh..., I wonder why some people don't get it...

...our images are what we mirror into our world...so, if we have a peaceful image that comes from God/Universe/within/or whatever you want to name it, then we can reflect that into our world. One way to connect with that peace within is through meditation. When we are peaceful, we integrate that into our life; we bring that image and show it to others...see, this is how it can be...if you want it... Jesus teaches the same thing. It is said we are made in the image of God. Wouldn't you like that image?

Dear Dr. Chopra,

The media is all about constructing Images. It is sad that equal time is not given to presenting all sides of the story. The media is skilled at showing favoritism to the favorite person or issue of its governing board of directors. There is even now an effort being made to further prevent the fair expression of both sides of the story. There are certain political figures who wish to eliminate the voices on the air that challenge their viewpoints.

The story on "global warming" is not being presented fairly. There are numerous scientists of high repute who disagree with the explanations being given for global warming. Their voices are being stifled by the mass media. The modus operandi is to withhold information and to thereby keep people in the dark.

I recently watched a program about the founding fathers of our United States of America. It showed how these men had high ideals firmly rooted in faith in God and in the desire for divine guidance. They wished to protect the God-given rights of mankind and to allow liberty and justice for all.

One of the quottions given was that of Patrick Henry who said,"When a people forget their God, then tyrants forge their chains". This is where we are today because our governing agencies have lost sight of God. It is now not "politically correct" to mention God and He is no longer recognized y the secular humanists in charge of our "so-called" institutes of higher learning.

Best Wishes,

"Betsy" S.

Dear Dr. Chopra,

I am astounded by your representation of Republicans ..."Republicans have become experts at negative images that frighten people, arouse xenophobia, furtively play on racism, and trumpet nonsensical slogans like, "It's morning in America." While I generally find your comments highly inspirational and especially inspired, I find that you have a totally incorrect concept of what both Republicans and Democrats represent. Evidently, you have been informed by some excellent propagandists and have been led astray. Republicans are not furtively playing on racism. How can you believe that? Republicans are not xenophobic; they simply want to protect the rights of their own citizens before giving unlimited access to citizenship rights to illegal persons who do not wish to honor the laws of this country.

If there is opposition to Obama it is because he is seen to be too inexperienced for the Presidency, not because he is of a different race. It is because his associations give rise to great uneasiness. He uses religious references to make himself appear righteous. I have heard it reported that he is telling groups opposed to gay marriage that he supports them while his wife is telling gay rights groups the exact opposite. We should be afraid of the half- truths we are being fed. Some people will say anything in order to get what they want.

Best Wishes,

"Betsy" S.

Gosh "Betsy" S. I've been wrong about everything.

Thanks for opening my eyes to the truth. I guess all those Republican I used to go to church with who joked about killing fags, lynching niggers and shooting spics as they crossed the Rio Grande were a figment of my imagination. It's so weird because I can remember it like it was yesterday. It must have been some liberal media mind control.

"It is now not "politically correct" to mention God and He is no longer recognized y the secular humanists in charge of our "so-called" institutes of higher learning."

I work at an institution of higher learning and we have religious studies, Christian groups and services on Campus. The faculty wish more students were going to church and class and not drinking themselves sick.

"The media is all about constructing Images." 'Betsy' S.

Images.
Images, BaBy.

Media are...

Not media is.

One medium.
Two or more media.

Makes me think of John Stuart Mill:

"Not all conservatives are stupid people, but most stupid people are conservatives."

As apt today as it was 150 years ago. Conservatives have no grown wiser over the decades.

Like HELL they're not "Betsy" S.

righttttttt...

The GOP didn't do the Willie Horton ad... or the Harold Ford ad... they haven't demonized all muslims as Islamofacism... or gays as waiting to crawl from under your bed and turn you gay in your sleep.

Oh wait... yes they did... dammit... they are bigoted racists after all!

"Republicans are not furtively playing on racism. How can you believe that? Republicans are not xenophobic; they simply want to protect the rights of their own citizens before giving unlimited access to citizenship rights to illegal persons who do not wish to honor the laws of this country."

I used to be a Republican. For many, many years. And if you believe half of what you wrote, you're either a fool, a liar, or on drugs.

gee it would be nice if

Republicans had never played the "Southern Strategy" game and made ads like

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EC9j6Wfdq3o

and

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIyewCdXMzk

It would be nice if McCain knew the basics of national security policy (e. g., Iran is a Shiite country and wouldn't be training Al Qeda forces there (Sunni)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5trxPYpYNQ

Betsy S.

I am SHOCKED, shocked, I tell you, that you would be astounded by Deepak's representation of Republicans.

Setting aside any discussion of racism or sexism, let's just look at the head of the Republican party, that guy in the White House who will most likely end up with a single-digit approval rating before he leaves office.

This is the guy who said God talked to him and told him to attack Iraq.

But when Obama makes religious references (because Democrats aren't allowed to do that??) he's pretending to be righteous?

Don't wait for me to quit laughing...just take Bush and go, ok?

To the poster of comment #17:

Your (cognitive) "associations give rise to great uneasiness." Dopey post--go educate yourself.

"Betsy",

You're easily astounded.

Actually, I think people have been really restrained here. Republicans (who still call themselves Republicans)are much worse. And McCain's associations give rise to more than uneasiness; they make me sick.

Re. 16, 17

Of course not all Republicans are evil.....

Many are unthinking low information voters who just don't care about anyone but their own pocketbooks. They haven't observed that Republicans run up deficits and Democrats pay them down. I want all of you to turn in your Social Security and Medicare. Have you no principals taking money from the government you despise?

Oh and Rush Limbaugh is a big fat liar who does drugs and mocks black people. Don't forget the disabled ... and soldiers... and ... Well, please stop listening to that drug addict on the radio. He's being paid huge sums of money to convince you of total lies.

Global warming is real and you and your children and your grandchildren are going to feel it's effects, if you haven't already.

Rethuglicans are bigots and racists and xenophobes, which is totally evident in everything they do and say and believe.

Feel free to believe in whatever you want to believe in, just don't try to shove your faith down my throat. It's unAmerican to do that.

It's not about Obama's experience (though he's had tremendous experience in things that count), it's about his superior BRAINS. You voted for a moron. Twice. Time to wake up, see what you've done by voting for that moron.

Peace.

@ 17, 18

Wow! This changes EVERYTHING!!

I might take a nap or something.

Before I do, I might add how grateful we libruls are for our treatment at the hands of Rush, Hannity, O'Reily, Coulter, etc. who are always top-notch with their civil discourse. Our guys just can't compete.

"Betsy" S.

If you're only astounded at Deepak Chopra's post...

Then we're not really trying. That hurts.

Seriously.

The culture of impunity is the bastard child of corruption and incompetence, which both sprang forth from the Gingrich Revolution fully formed with malignant intentions. This is not your father's Republican Party and there is no end to the abominations sired by this promiscuous mutant Republican philosophy... And, inevitably, each outrage will be reduced to a relative misdemeanor as the Republican government pioneers new perversions of the Oath of Office.

President Ford’s singular paragraph in history was earned by pardoning a crooked President, but still I feel sorry for him. He deserved better than to lie in wake surrounded by grave robbers, cannibals and necrophiliacs. The cable networks dutifully broadcast the chants of Beltway necromancers mean sadists who disembowel his character... Poor President Ford will be summoned back from the dead and enslaved as an unwilling golem in the defense of President George W. Bush, Vice President Richard Cheney and dozens of lesser officials who went afoul of the Constitutional Order with malicious intent.

I put effort into my demagoguery, damnit.

"Some people will say anything in order to get what they want." Betsy S.

Yep. Did you get what you wanted?

Okay I'll bite.

No one refutes that global warming is happening or that it has to do with increased CO2 levels in the atmosphere.

So the idea that we've spent the last century HEAVILY burning carbon (which releases high quanities of CO2) have absolutely nothing to do with it?

Are you high? Do you need me to duct tape your break in logic?

Also, many of the founding fathers weren't even Christians, they were deists and agnostics and believed in FREEDOM of everyone in religion more than institutionalization of THEIR religion.

Poster of the back to back comments #16 and 17 needs a brain enema to relieve the constipation of so much crap packed into such a small space.

Huh?

Wow, "Betsy" S. you are really quite naive. I'll leave my criticism to global warming. I'm sure there are some who say it isn't occurring but they are few and continue to get smaller. What bothers me about Republicans is that in the face of facts they opt to ignore them in favor of some political agenda. Get over your political agenda and self identity and look at facts. Global warming is occurring and there is little doubt that humans are, in part, responsible for it.

Name them all. All of them.

Name all of those "scientists of high repute who disagree with the explanations being given for global warming."

~Doc~

Probably...

...some of these quacks.

http://www.city-data.com/forum/politics-other-controversies/248106-article-right-wing-paying-scientists-dispute.html

Those "scientists of high repute" all went to the highly esteemed Acme Correspondence School for Climatology & Cosmetology.

Please think it through...

"Betsy" writes,

"It is sad that equal time is not given to presenting all sides of the story. THE MEDIA IS SKILLED AT SHOWING FAVORITISM TO THE FAVORITE PERSON OR ISSUE OF ITS *GOVERNING BOARD OF DIRECTORS*" (Emphasized)

Now. Ask yourself: Who exactly comprises the governing board of directors for media? Well, do a little research on these companies and you find the board members also sit on the boards of--interlock with--the:

• military industry
• financial/banking industry
• pharmaceutical industry
• chemical industry
• mass-food industry

Now ask yourself: Are these boards Democratic or Republican in the main? Good. Now add two and two, and you should get:

"It is sad that equal time is not given to presenting all sides of the story. The media is skilled at showing favoritism to the REPUBLICAN AGENDA of its governing board of directors."

Show me where I'm wrong. You can see a hundred videos on youtube of nothing but John McCain talking out of both sides of his mouth on any issue. Sometimes he's all "white" on one day and two days later he's all "black." Yet, McCain is presented as a straight-shooter, man of integrity type. When he lies practically daily, and easily demonstrated lies at that.

Gimme a break.

Dear Deepak,

There is guarantee that the best image 'will' win until we break the corporate virtual monopoly on what we hear and see, we keep losing, don't matter what we do.

#35 Should read "There is NO guarantee..."

@ Betsy

Many founding fathers were Unitarians and we mostly vote Dem these days. You've gotta catch up, bub.

#37

And Deists, which were one shade away from being completely atheist.

More on Deism, and the Founding Fathers who practiced it, is at this link.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism

Actually... if you read history... the Puritans, Quakers, Protestants, etc... all set up their own little communities, and would persecute everyone who wasn't of their faith.

So, once the Constitution was being written, ALL of these groups tried to get THEIR religion as THE religion and our founding fathers were having none of it.

Comments by "Betsy" S. in this thread are the most disorganized piece of writing I have ever read at IntentBlog or any other blog in a long time.

The responder starts out with an attack on the media in one paragraph; jumps to a paragraph on global warming; and then immediately goes off on a tangent on how the Founding Fathers 'really' were religious or some revisionist bullshit like that. It then concludes with more right-wing bullshit re: democratic presidential nominee. It's a veritable smorgasbord of right-wing talking points!

Oh, and speaking of smorgasboards:

"SCANDINAVIAN SMORGASBORD

Our Menu
Gravlax with mustard sauce
Cucumber salad
Herring salad
Cold loin of pork with figs
Beet and orange salad
Selection of cheeses
Breads and crackers
Aquavit and vodka
Beer
Swedish cookies

After a season of grilling chicken breasts on the patio and tossing pasta salads until we’re blue in the face, are we ready for something a little different this Indian summer? How about a smorgasbord?

Now, there are smorgasbords and then there are smorgasbords. The term generally has come to mean any groaning board of food that eclipses a mere buffet, regardless of ethnic origin. In Sweden, however, it’s an enormous spread of specific hot and cold foods, from herring salads to Swedish meatballs. But for our purposes, we’re going to stick with the cold stuff."

http://www.samcooks.com/flavor/ScandinavianSmorgasbord.htm

Reading those couple of comments makes me wanna go for some of that Aquavit and vodka, personally.

So many concerns...

...Global warming concerns.

..."God" concerns.

...Republicans being falsely framed as racists concerns.

...Concerns over Obama using his fake Christianity to get votes.

...Concerns over the Founding Fathers' take on religion/God.

...Experience (or lack thereof) concerns.

...Propaganda concerns (no concern shown over Fixed News, of course).

...Media too biased concerns.

So many concerns, so little time.

Betsy does, however, get props for not showing any concern for McCain.

So few brain cells...

Yeah.

I forgot the biggie...

..Concern for Republicans.

As the responder revealed, once you establish your concern for Republicans, you have suddenly constructed a tree from which many other concerns can emerge as branches from the main Republican tree concern.

Betsy S.,

Keep your God to yourself.

The founding fathers made sure of that when they passed a Constitution separating your church from our government.

"I have heard it reported that he is telling groups opposed to gay marriage that he supports them while his wife is telling gay rights groups the exact opposite."

sheesh

You gotta take a break from Faux News. You heard it "reported" for godz sake?

Obama's position on Gay Right's is consistent. He was/is never for gay "marriage," as in a marriage in a Church. But he was/is always for gay marriage as a Civil Union, and he supports the States' rights.

OMG! I see the light, Betsy

All this time I spent drinking the kool-aid of the liberal press and its unrepentant propagandists was for naught.

I gonna head to the nearest airport bathroom and join the GOP.

Now my ugly response.

Go to Hell, Betsy Troll.

Obama "inexperienced"? He's a brilliant man who spent his adult life working for those in need. Obama's "associations" are a problem but not Hagee and genocide advocate, Parsley? Go to Hell, you lying sack of trash.

Why am I angry at all the Republicans and about half the Democrats? Unilateral attack on the country that didn't attack us. bin Laden and Mullah Omar still alive. Budget deficit. Tax cuts for the rich that is the cause of the deficit. The on-going lie that tax cuts result in economic growth. Torture. Violation of the 4th amendment. Absolutely, no leadership on issues of energy, none. Well, I could go on, but at the end of the day, I'm not happy with Republicans because their policies have failed, which was predictable to anyone who took the trouble to investigate rather than simply believe what we were being told.

You're full of crap "Betsy" S.

"Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed by inserting "Jesus Christ," so that it would read "A departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;" the insertion was REJECTED BY THE GREAT MAJORITY, in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mohammedan, the Hindoo and Infidel of every denomination."

-Thomas Jefferson, Autobiography, in reference to the Virginia Act for Religious Freedom

[emphasis added]

***

"I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever in religion, in philosophy, in politics, or in anything else where I was capable of thinking for myself. Such an addiction is the last degradation of a free and moral agent."

-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Francis Hopkinson, March 13, 1789

***

"I have found Christian dogma unintelligible. Early in life I absented myself from Christian assemblies."

Benjamin Franklin, in Toward The Mystery

***

"When philosophic reason is clear and certain by intuition or necessary induction, no subsequent revelation supported by prophecies or miracles can supersede it."

-- John Adams, from Rufus K Noyes, Views of Religion, quoted from from James A Haught, ed, 2000 Years of Disbelief

***

"The priesthood have, in all ancient nations, nearly monopolized learning.... And, even since the Reformation, when or where has existed a Protestant or dissenting sect who would tolerate A FREE INQUIRY?"

-- John Adams, letter to John Taylor, 1814, quoted in Norman Cousins, In God We Trust: The Religious Beliefs and Ideas of the American Founding Fathers (1958), p. 108, quoted from James A Haught, ed, 2000 Years of Disbelief

***

"I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish Church, by the Roman Church, by the Greek Church, by the Turkish Church, by the Protestant Church, nor by any Church that I know of. My own mind is my own Church."

-- Thomas Paine, The Age of Reason

This is for the benefit of Yogi-one and especially Ruth:

Concern Trolling 101

http://www.mydd.com/story/2008/7/4/152233/8356

A must read for everyone interested in political discussions at IntentBlog

To All Concerned:

The violent reaction to my comments by those who disagree would demonstrate to me that they are allowing themselves to be guided by their raw emotions, rather than by a desire for a rational discussion of issues. This is precisely why I do not generally care to discuss politics. Most of the vehement responses have come from people who I am not familiar with on Intent Blog. Why do they not comment on other issues of greater importance than politics?

Best Wishes,

"Betsy" S.

What's sad about the politically ignorant, self-righteous, true hypocrites like "Betsy S." is that the standard, Christian Wing representation of Republicans -- or really, conservatives are who we're talking about -- here at IntentBlog really IS infused with so much groupthink psychosis that as a mass we -- Democratic leaning liberal and spiritual progressives -- are completely unable to debate on a fundamental level with them. It's impossible to debate certain things in good faith with the "other side."

And it's sad, and it's pathetic, and it doesn't do us any favors. And, I'll add, it's mutual.

But what "Betsy" S. did was a bad, ineffective presentation of that idea.

Definition of a contemporary typical republican:

"Some people will say anything in order to get what they want." ~"Betsy" S.

Raw emotions are good, stupid. That's what make us want to have sex, and heal, stupid.
Now I must go to the store for milk, be in a sweet, smart mood when I get back.

Aloha Everyone

Government is a loose coalition of bureaucracy. We govern our selves. Don't buy the masquerade. Government is just a metaphor that it is an inside job. It is a time for a revelation:) and of course vote for Obama. love patty

Republicans = selfish, greedy, dumbasses

what are we shocked about??

Oh...I guess we should have added selfish, greedy, racist and sexist dumbasses...for accuracy's sake.

Well, "Betsy" S., I don't need media representations of Republicans.

I f**king live in Alabama. They're everywhere. They are selfish, thoughtless, clueless, and their attitudes are all "I got mine, screw you."

They are racist and classist, and they for sure aren't furtive about it!

"It's impossible to debate certain things in good faith with the "other side." IW

They have no good faith.

In their minds they are right and they are good which means we must be wrong AND bad by definition.

Does not compute.

But, John, that's true the other way around...

Yeah, Irvine. For some, I agree.

I was horribly disillusioned by the primary when the very same poor critical thinking qualities seemed to reign supreme on the left.

But it's not as heavy and not as celebrated on the left as it is on the right.

Indeed, Preity! That's why in 2008 no one wants to be a republican! Polls show that Republican party identity is shrinking among the public. Democratic identity is growing and so are the Independents.

And for "Betsy" S.,

you may be interested to know that your low information cousins, the whites who didn't pass 12th grade, Obama lags by 17 points [latest Gallup poll], which is no suprise, given the southern racist agenda and the cultural propaganda of the republican party, which works best with the ignorant and the gullible.

And as per your case of media "representation" of the Republicans and Democrats, let this REALITY sink into your Thick Skull:

"An audience that decides for itself, based on "fair and balanced" coverage, ought not to reach monolithic conclusions. Yet, in our 2004 polling with Media Vote, using Nielsen diaries, we found that Fox News viewers supported George Bush over John Kerry by 88 percent to 7 percent. No demographic segment, other than Republicans, was as united in supporting Bush. Conservatives, white evangelical Christians, gun owners, and supporters of the Iraq war all gave Bush fewer votes than did regular Fox News viewers."

http://thehill.com/mark-mellman/hounding-fox-news-coverage-2007-03-20.html

I had wondered why Indy has made his comment on open thread. Perhaps this is why after I read through this group of political motivated comments.

Deepak began this discussion with the thought that images are the powerful means by which elections are won.

In advertising, television, and through news media marketing techniques, image is everything.

So we have a sharp contrast between the image of a vital, enthusiastic, young male, finally one of color, who is the nominee for the Democratic party versus the image of the white-haired, senior, who served his country and was elected to his valor as a pow and his assertiveness to protect his fellow pow's. It is almost like the movie The Candidate starring Robert Redford which was made in the 70's as I remember it very well.

I actually have a small part in that movie, as my friend George Carlin once told me, it is all on the clothes that I wear.

And even that silly joke of a role came true years later as well, but that is telling tales out of school so I will remain button-lipped on that one.

I digressed a bit.

Obama is the first black candidate to ever have made the electorate take him seriously as I recall when another black candidate ran for office also. Her name was Shirley Chisholm and nobody took her seriously at all. But this is the year that Shirley gets the last laugh in the Democratic party because it produced both Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama to finally prove that her act of breaking the ice made it possible for both Hillary and Barack to be viable candidates.

As for McCain, this is his only chance to show that when the Republicans had the chance to vote for him when he was younger, he was shunned for the vast great experience of George Bush, a man who had only served as Governor of the state of Texas. He has less experience in government than even others who had also run at that time, but American Republicans, being already infected by his father, decided that like father, like son would produce some kind of strange administration, and sure enough, the electorate was correct, for George like his father before him, led the USA and its allies into another battle with Saddam Hussein and Iraq.

Does this mean that the electorate is either lazy, indifferent, uncaring, or what? Does it mean that Americans can not truly govern well, especially in the art of choosing candidates to represent them in office?

Does that America with so many demonstrated failures in self government have the right to tell any other nation in the world how to run its government? Such as in the case of Iraq where it would seem that it is simply a failure of the Bush Adminsitration if democracy does not take root and flourish there.

Does America have the right or the obligation to inflict its form of government onto other nations?

Well, that is what politics is all about? And so these images of these two men who do not really want anything but personal power, personal achievement, personal recognition by their peers, and personal glory through attainment of that highest office in the land will be constantly played before the American public again and again til we decide which of the two we really do want to have to watch his face appear for four years for a certainty if he is healthy and robust enough. Whose face will it be? For four years! And if liked well enough, for another four. Barack has mentioned that in 2016 he will be leaving his office when elected for terms. So is Barack Obama's face the face of the next president? Or is it the face of John McCain?

To me, it is like the dog races, young C dog going up against old A dog going down. Which dog will win?

Now I have another comment to make. I do not appreciate it when people turn ugly and make ugly comments about a person's statements on any topic. We all have the right to a point of view, and to express that point of view, but personal attacks are unnecessary.

I know Betsy S personally and I know that she is a gracious, warmhearted, loving person. It is due to her suggestion that I came to this discussion group. I met her at the local library where we both use the public computer system.

I admire her desire to continue to educate herself,and to find topics of interest which she carefully studies before placing them on the board for discussion.

She is a lively lovely lady and does not deserve to have to have members hurl insults at her. Speak with respect when you post, as sooner or later, your thoughts will come back to rest upon you.

But at least she appears to have stimulated interest. And that alone is worth the effort.

For the most part, neither Democrats or Republicans are ever anything but totally boring....as is all politics!

Honorable one time IB Moron Award Winner Arizona,

Before you come to the defense of your friend "Betsy" S., and trow in "its all politics" and equivocate on Democrats and Republicans and their respective nominees, and show off your ignorance regarding the political process, I would like to enlighten you why Democrats, better elected-Democrats and a democratic president who supports progressive policies matter to the future of America.

Apparently it can be rest assured that you knwo little about the importance of passing legislative laws in the House and Senate and the power of the president to veto such bills.

Here's a handy case study on today's Medicare Vote. What we are looking for in this election is not just a democratic president who doesn't veto against crucial bills, but also a bigger majority in the Senate to achieve a filibuster proof. President Clinton passed his most important economic reform bills in his first 4 months of presidency when the democrats had the majority in the Congress. This laid the foundation for the economic growth we saw. Unfortunately, he lost the Congress and many important reforms like Health Care were left rotten up until now.

Just today, this afternoon we have seen a clear reason why 60 votes in the Senate matters. A couple weeks ago, the Senate voted on legislation that would stave off greater than a 10 percent cut to doctors providing service to Medicare patients, as well as certain veterans. Although the measure passed overwhelmingly in the House -- to the tune of 355 to 59, with most Republicans voting in favor of the measure -- Republicans in the Senate decided to filibuster the bill leaving it a single vote short of attaining cloture.

Senate Majority leader Harry Reid subsequently switched his "yes" vote to a "no" in order to preserve the option of bringing the bill back to the floor for another vote -- a prerogative he made use of this afternoon. And YOU KNOW WHAT, Senator Ted Kennedy, who has not been back to the Senate since he underwent brain surgery, made his triumphant return to the chamber to provide the Medicare bill its 60th supporter in the House.

Immediately thereafter, nine GOP Senators, all of whom had been to that point steadfastly in opposition to the bill -- even in the face of a strong push from the Democrats and a super strong push from the AMA, which has been an overwhelming supporter of the GOP in years past -- switched their position on the legislation. All of the sudden, as a result of getting a 60th vote, the bill went from having 59 to 39 support in the Senate to having 69 to 30 support -- more than enough to override a threatened veto from President Bush (assuming those Senators vote the same on an override vote as they did on the cloture vote). Not even a visit by Vice President Dick Cheney to lobby Senate Republicans could stem this movement.

This is exactly what the power of 60 is and why it is so important to strive for 60 Democratic Senators in the 111th Congress. It is why we need to not just elect a democratic president but also tear down John Ensign's 41-seat firewall. When a bill or an amendment has enough support to sustain a filibuster, it is much easier for the minority party to keep in line. But once the majority can get to 60 votes -- a task made all the much more easy if the party has 60 seats, or close to it (even if not all of the members vote together on a particular issue) -- Senators in the minority are much more free to vote their conscience (or at least as the political winds are blowing) with the majority.

This is not always the case, and it will not always be the case. Having 60 Democratic Senators come January would not necessarily mean that the war would end immediately, or that universal healthcare would be easily achieved. But as you can see with today's vote on Medicare payments to doctors, 60 votes matters -- and even getting one more voice on the path to that goal can make all the difference in the world.

Currently, the democrats hold a narrow 51 seat majority in the Senate. (this includes Joe Lieberman who votes with the Democratic caucus.)
Electing democrats and electing better democrats is a priority. One can pass 4 decades worth of Reform with a progressive president leading over a bipartisan 60 seat Senate majority of 'either' party. Electing better democrats is a priority as much as electing Obama. The choice is pretty clear. This is about our ability to have Universal Health Care, an Energy Independent policy, to end the War in Iraq and in taking crucial Climate Change initiatives.

Obama is not exempt form criticism from the democrats who support him. He will be held accountable as a candidate and as a president. He may not agree with everything on every issue dear to me. Change comes form bottom up, not top down. That's the philosophy that is respected by the progressive Democrats and their leaders, unlike the Republicans.

I like you Arizonasunset, I like your name, I like the colors you make.
The reason folks rag on you is because your so very bright! I love that! you inspire. Love you, of course!

Thank you, Tammy, I appreciate your positive attitude.

Indy, there is an old saying, It takes one to know one, so I gather that you are the Chief Moron who seems to know and recognize all the others.

Since you do not know my politics, or why, I think it is all advised of you to be the sole representative for the Democratic banner. Your attitude would probably elect more Republicans to office than you can imagine.

But for the record, I remain an independent thinker and voter. I would abolish party politics and have politicans become free agents as Hollywood actors and actresses did so long ago.

No party can truly represent the interests of any group of people and usually the democratic party means labor and the republican party means management. It is just all that simple, one is like the head and the other like the legs.

Both are supported by same financial interests so everyone who has been in politics for a long time knows that there is no real difference between the two parties at all, but just when it comes to winning votes, who can befuddle and fool the people quicker and faster than the other one can.
\

There are many people who aren't really interested in politics out of progressive passion--they just find politics an amusing subject, like movies and dog races.

The Week That Should Have Ended McCain's Presidential Hopes

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/max-bergmann/the-week-that-should-have_b_111983.html

10 McCain gaffes in a week!

Check it out.

But the media doesn't care. The networks love a dog race narrative for viewership ratings.

And of course the corporates and the affluent love Bush-McCain Republican tax cuts for the wealthy as it serves their self-interests even at the expense of ridiculous economic plan which not a single economist substantially agrees with.

HI Indy,

I thought of you today when FoxReport announced the failure of a bank in California, IndyMac.

Well, yes, usually politicians are compared to horses as movie stars are usually considered a stable of stars too. So it is with politicians, most are just a stable of wannabes getting to the winner's circle.

Seriously, I am caught in a dilemma. I have always been against the war in Iraq and have been promoting Barack Obama to be the nominee of the Democrats so that there would be a real showdown between him and McCain. Now all of sudden, Barack Obama is starting to sound more and more like any other politician, suddenly hedging his bets, knowing full well that if he is elected he will be faced with a problem that was begun in the Clinton administration, remember when the WTC was bombed from underground but failed to take it down. In 93 that occurred, and I read it made Osama bin Laden so angry that no response was made to it, that it took a change of administration to try it again and get the war that Osama really wanted. In other words, Bush was suckered into going into Iraq, doing the dirty work that the Muslim world could not do for itself, but that America had to do, and that was to get rid of Saddam Hussein. So if Barack Obama learns that some dirty secrets exist within the White House he then will be faced with having to resolve these problems and maybe break some promises, like getting out of Iraq asap.

So who knows? I frankly do not think that John McCain is anything like George Bush and is trying to sound as conservative as his backers want him to sound, but not to worry, if elected, he would go back to being his own real self if he could do it.

I am just waiting to see which it will be that the electorate will decide upon in November. So far, neither is making people sit up and take notice. After the conventions, maybe it will all matter.

But yeah, young dogs who are fast enough are generally always the better bet at a dog race. A dogs start getting tired after awhile, and I personally believe that McCain does not improve his image too much by always portraying himself when he was young and handsome. He reminds me a bit of an old Charlie Chaplin now.

An Observation on Political Discussions:

Why is it that discussions about differences in political opinions seem to bring out the very worst in people? I do think that this topic is even more inflammatory than that of religion. Could it be because politics is basically a most superficial ideology which actually has no really positive outcome to be expected? It is sad that some people believe that by making insulting and inflammatory remarks that are somehow more believable. Actually, the exact o pposite is true. When no "class act" is being presented, then credibility is nonexistent.

"Betsy" S.

Sorry about the spelling problems in the last posting. I was running out of time on the library computer. Some people are most unforgiving about misspelled words and such as they do not allow for special handicaps encountered by some writers.

So, I will retype what I meant to say: It is sad that some people believe that by making insulting and inflammatory remarks that they are somehow more believable. Actually, the exact opposite is true.

WHEN NO "CLASS ACT" IS BEING PRESENTED, THEN CREDIBILITY IS NONEXISTENT.

"Betsy" S.

HI Betsy, I finally found these two entries. You wonder why politics brings about the worst in people. I suppose it is a fact that self rule in government does bring out such a variety of people who believe that they can impose their own lifestyles on others that that is the real reason that Ben Franklin is correct in his assertion that democracy is the "worst" form of government. Democracy is mob rule by ballot instead of by bullet!

This is precisely why I do not generally care to discuss politics. Most of the vehement responses have come from people who I am not familiar with on Intent Blog