Great post.

dear Kavita,
It is sad to me when I hear someone taking one's own life - or others lives.

I know suffering, I know despair and challenges - but I am able to seek solace, understanding and peace from within, and also through the love and friendships of cherished ones, who care deeply.

There is still a stigma against depression, against mental illness. It seems many do not seek out help or solutions, beyond continuing to hurt, or hurt others.

love
~ Kate

Depression is not the problem, the soul-lessness of capitalism is the problem!

Peace

I only blame Karthik, not society or anything else. I don't care what the reason is, he murdered his whole family for his failings or immorality or whatever you pin on this monster, that's what he is. He made money and lost it, even made money on his house.

He murdered his whole family, please don't blame society.

Anger is the appropriate response, one can only imagine how the extended family and community must feel right now?

the economy might have been a major trigger to push this deranged man over the top...and in this sense...what is happening by those in charge of running the economy and the country might be partly to blame...th collapse of the market, the draining of hundreds of billions fighting an insane war...

Aloha Kavita

Some questions only God has the answer. I believe we all have scared contracts. The fact is we will all die, we just don't know when and how. They say we choose how and when to have the most impact on those around us. I choose to believe Karthik Rajaram and his family are helping us to make the shift that human life is more valuable than the dollar.

Depression is like a black hole that consumes a person and we are each that black hole. We are information and energy, and Karthik Rajaram and his family has pulled us within where we remember we were never born and never die. Their lives have made a difference for we are the Light before daylight and night.

A really good movie to see is Sean Penn in 21 Grams. Mahalo for your Aloha, love patty

That is the funny thing. Not that there is anything funny about this crazy dude killing his whole family. But the “funny” thing is is that I have often thought about getting a gun, and one bullet, and committing the perhaps one unpardonable biblical sin, in addition to blaspheming the Holy Spirit of course, and just ending my life.

But even being the “career” criminal that I am, killing anybody, anybody, because I am a failure in life, or have been defiled by the American, I mean, capitalist way, has never “occurred” to me; but the funny thing about these people that go postal, is that they were good little Americans beforehand one day, and them BAM BAM BAM they “simply” go Goldenstein.

But I suppose for God, or the godlessness of capitalism, is a good enough reason to go postal. Not me though; I’ll be content with just taking myself out!

Peace

Well, my father shot himself execution style, so if you have any family at all, think about the pain they will go thru, even tho it might be an easy out. Plus, you will have to come back to this very same place again, as you will never escape a lesson, even if it takes you thousands of life times to learn and rise above it. You (we) will learn our lesson, and deep within, we really do want to rise above it all. We all make mistakes and it's seems so very hard at times, but remember that your soul is so very precious and all this is really just a class room and nothing else. You will never die!

PS: I want some of that gum

Aloha empyrius

There is a saying, "No one shoots off their foot." And I have had times where I have said, "What was I thinking?" I am sure Karthik Rajaram is saying that because we only go deeper to come out more abstract. Love is forgiving as for giving. It is always for the Grace of God, there go I. When pointing the finger, there is four pointing back, The reporter is always the thief, it is to know there is no greater thief then my thinking as it spirals around.

What goes around comes around. Look at OJ Simpson, 13 years to the day when he had been acquitted in killing Nicole and Ron Goldman, he is back in jail for life. Guilt kills. That is why it is important to know you can die and reincarnate in the present to remember what we do to others we do to our self. Our behavior changes instantly. As Krishnamurti says "Everything is an echo of self." I see you breathing Life into everyone you touch and when not your Love is expanding to mean more. We are God playing man, not man playing God. love patty

hmmmm

It is truly unfortunate when one's view of one's value and honor is wound up in money.

"What is Success?" by Ralph Waldo Emerson

To laugh often and much;

To win the respect of intelligent people
and the affection of children;

To earn the appreciation of honest critics
and endure the betrayal of false friends;

To appreciate beauty;
To find the best in others;

To leave the world a bit better, whether by
a healthy child, a garden patch
or a redeemed social condition;

To know even one life has breathed
easier because you have lived;

This is to have succeeded.

Kavita,

I see it as an identify crisis which is the effect or reflection of external values. When we make that inner shift everything else will shift.

We could keep our eyes and ears open for those who are isolated as well as those who are bullied...and even those who bully. Where to begin? Exactly where one lives in this exact moment.

Support your tribe in your very own village. Where does that begin and where does that end?

Trish~~

Thank you all. Char I was deeply moved reading your post.

I think its ironic in some ways that there is Troy Davis, a man on death row fighting for his life for 20 years, and totally at peace with himself.He doesn't want any freebies, is very non-materialistic. When I asked if I could help in anyway, he said his mother taught him not to take more than he needed and he really didn't need much, while another death row inmate in Texas was asking people to send cash to him. The richest gift for Troy would be his freedom, to walk in sunshine again. His family is not wealthy, but the love that emanates from them is unbelievable. They are the real deal.

And then here is this family which had the education and the intelligence to work through any issue, if they applied their mind to it, and were free, free to touch the grass, to hold each other close, and the man kills the whole family and himself. Troy turns 40 in jail tomorrow, and the Rajarams will never celebrate any birthday again.

I think of the little boys, one found on the floor-did he get up and see his father and smiled a trusting smile..only to be betrayed in death..I can't bring myself to hate any one who has suicidal thoughts because every one goes through their own angst through the years, and I don't think there is any one alive who hasn't thought of death in some form or the other. But why does it come to the point of hopelessness that someone takes this extreme step?

I think the South Asian community is becoming more and more vulnerable to something like this, not because of the financial crisis or anything else, but because they live in fear of being found out-of being anything less than perfect, and never seek help. The external circumstances are just things that happen around us..what really makes that difference between life and death, or knowing right from wrong is what is really going on inside us.
Some one once said people live either in fear or in greed..and that causes most of the mess.

I have never seen a content, happy person filled with hatred or self destruction.
Somewhere along the way we have forgotten that inner well being, inner security, is so key to our external well being. I can't judge this man because I don't know the inner circumstances, but it worries me that suicide attempts and crimes of passion are on the rise-people killing others full of angst because they feel uncared for or unloved. It makes innocent lives vulnerable as well. One of my friends said she wouldn't let her son to go out of state for college because she has this false sense of security that if he is in town, he is closer if he needs help of any kind.

We are just making our lives far more complicated than we should. I was talking to my mom and dad and they said things were a lot simpler and happier when they were growing up because people were not chasing big bucks and family ties were very close and friendships very strong.

Aloha Kavita

If we didn't have death life would be a punishment. Terminal illness creates terminal aliveness. Fear is False Evidence Appearing Real. It is to live a life of metaphors, you have to go deep to see what is being said. African Americans have been oppressed from eons. To think I could walk the dance Troy is walking, I don't think so, only in remembering I am that I am. It is then I go to the source I am all that is. Again the fact is we all die, we just don't know when or how. There are a lot of yets out there and it is to identify not to compare. We are alive now and in that aliveness we know there is no wasted life or moment.

love patty

All the help we need is right inside...

Stop poisoning ourselves

Nutritionaly, socialy, mentaly, Spiritualy, subjectively and objectivley Stop the poison.

What youh ave and are as a human being is a magical state of being... the foundation of your being outside of the poison you force upon it is a trillion times the positive of depression

Wake up to this...

dont poison yourself with toxic feelings, food, enviroments and give the body essence the room to heal itself to the state it already is outside of poison..

it is as plain as the nose on your face... you were born packaged in this intelligence of the miracle body!

love

Simon xx

Kavita:

When I read the story - and later - i couldn't figure out one thing in all this.. WHAT was his fear???

If he was unemployed and didnt have a job and couldnt pay for his house - he could have moved to another place for a job. Its not as if the jobs are finished.. specially for an educated person with stellar credentials!

And even if he became penniless.. he could STILL move to India and live in his parents place there.. or some small house.

How worse can it possibly get?

You know after 2001 I was on H1 visa - which means if a company lays you off you should leave the country within 12 days or so (unspecified time but conventional wisdom) - and my company was laying off folks... and I bought a house!! My logic was if I lose EVERYTHING then I can still go back to India and live in the house I grew up in.. and when I came I used to earn roughly $200-250 a month there.. and I was still VERY HAPPY with life! If THAT is where I have come from... then anything better than that but worse from what I have cannot mess me up.

SO, whenever you face an impossible situation always ask yourself - What is the ABSOLUTELY WORST CASE SCENARIO.? Can you live with it (why not?)? If yes, then why bother?

I have stayed once with a farmer for 2 months who used to eat TWICE a day and the food used to be Bajra-ki-roti (millet bread) and salty water with a few small potatoes thrown in. We shared the same diet for that period. And HE was very happy and content with life.

Can it get worse than that for people here?

cheers,
-desh
drishtikone.com

well i do not agree,I don't think this man was suffering from depression.He was scared that the underworld in the US would kill him and his family brutally.That is why he might have killed them all.

I think there are so many things to think about
when you ask what is wrong with the picture. The suicide murder in America or any part of the world and the rising suicide rates, as well as acts of violence in countries like Finland for example where a man went on a shooting spree recently, something that was unheard of, makes you wonder, why is all this happening?
Chemical imbalance is also on the rise. We could say earlier the cases were undocumented so one didn't hear as much, but now every one talks
about the chemicals in the foods we eat affecting us. So is that playing a role?

Many times, all we need is someone to talk to, and that is where counseling comes in.. someone who can put things in perspective for you. Indians often feel ashamed of going for counseling, as I mentioned. And perhaps that is true of many other cultures.

We live under the shadow of what will people think. I have done story after story, where that has been the case. Karthik Rajaram from latest
reports was showing erratic behaviour for a while. He would not show up for work, disappearing for a couple of days-this was a man who had a
perfect score on his GMAT, but was fired for erratic behavior.I don't think it even occurred to him to seek help.

I was speaking with Sadhguru Jaggi Vasudev the founder of Isha the other day and he said the pursuit of money has become the biggest epidemic in India. People are popping anti depressants, having heart attacks early, and working long
hours.. Suicide is on the rise. Is that the price developed and developing nations pay for progress?

I remember growing up surrounded by so many loving uncles and aunts and my two grandmothers and friends. My father was away in the Military
most of my early formative years, but my mother had such an amazing support system, or she would have gone crazy fending for two young children
and being away from a husband she adored and vice versa.
Today that support system has broken down so badly. Technological and economic advances have brought imbalance and loneliness. People are
constantly on their computers, blackberries or cell phones texting away.
There is limited human contact.

No one has time to call or hang out..its really sad.. and counseling and anti-depressants have replaced a loving family structure. Majority of
the people who are depressed, or scared because their lives have spun out of control probably don't need medication, but a loving nurturing
environment to get out of their slump, but do we see that much any where these days?

There are days, I just watch the faces of the drivers of cars passing by and I see exhaustion and fatigue, and discontent on most faces...
are we paying too heavy a price for economic progress? You tell me

Hi Kavita,

What you describe hereabove are growing pains in my humble view. We here in Europe went through the same after WW2.

Are you familiar with the latest book of Kishore Mahbubani?: "The NEW Asian Hemisphere, the irresistible shift of global power to the east".

Listen to a very good interview here:
\http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wc4eMtAqcvo

Perhaps you will be able to interview him?

Me am reading this book after I have seen him on Dutch television a couple of weeks ago.

It really is a good book, although Europe will in his view not be among the best economic parts of the world with the next 30 years.

Love, Mieke

Just like ones own children at a certain moment in their life need to be able to stand on their own two feet, the East now is growing fast and learning fast to be able to stand on their own feet.

I agree with Desh not to only focus on the money making but also on the fact that one has experienced the other side of the medal too and if worse comes to worse one can always bounce back if necessary.

I am just a simple housewife, coming from a poor family myself. My father enabled me to study a bit more than he did just so I could stand financially on my own two feet. Slowly but surely things went better but I and my generation with me, always remembered what our parents and we ourselves had to do for this and if necessary could go back to it.

Trouble with our children and their children, at least in the west, is that they haven't experienced poverty anymore. They do not know what that is. They will have much more difficulty to bounce back.

Perhaps it is our generation then, all over the world that can provide that wisdom?

Just some ramblings from my heart :)

Love, Mieke

OMG this news was just so very shocking...And all he did this for "what will people say"...I think it is embedded in the Indian culture.. ppl care wayy too much about what will others say... I've been realizing this more and more.. and its true too... ppl judge each other too much there...esp. based on money and job..